Front Bevel Gear Case Shaft Bearing

[Dane1966]

I purchased a 2007 Kawasaki Vulcan Mean Streak 1600 on Feb 1st, 2019. It is in pristine condition with 14,000 miles on it. I trailered it home and put it in my shed. A week ago we had a warm day. So I decided to take it out for a quick ride. ( I bought this bike from a dealer and never rode it ) It took it for a short ride down some side streets maybe 3 miles or so. Returning home, I was taking a left hand turn , downshifted to first gear. The bike stalled and the rear tire locked up.Clutch didn't work. Tranny was frozen, and rear wheel locked.I called the dealership up it took 3 of us to drag it into the van. I found out that the Front bevel bearing was the culprit. My question is Kawasaki knows this problem exists. Why did they not have a Re Call. Obviously many, many, owners have had this problem. It is a very expensive fix for a $25 bearing. Mine is still at the dealership torn down. I'm curious to see if they are going to charge me for the repair. When it obviously had the problem when I purchased it. And only rode it 3 miles ! I'll keep you folks posted on the outcome.

[mick56]

Originally Posted by Dane1966

I purchased a 2007 Kawasaki Vulcan Mean Streak 1600 on Feb 1st, 2019. It is in pristine condition with 14,000 miles on it. I trailered it home and put it in my shed. A week ago we had a warm day. So I decided to take it out for a quick ride. ( I bought this bike from a dealer and never rode it ) It took it for a short ride down some side streets maybe 3 miles or so. Returning home, I was taking a left hand turn , downshifted to first gear. The bike stalled and the rear tire locked up.Clutch didn't work. Tranny was frozen, and rear wheel locked.I called the dealership up it took 3 of us to drag it into the van. I found out that the Front bevel bearing was the culprit. My question is Kawasaki knows this problem exists. Why did they not have a Re Call. Obviously many, many, owners have had this problem. It is a very expensive fix for a $25 bearing. Mine is still at the dealership torn down. I'm curious to see if they are going to charge me for the repair. When it obviously had the problem when I purchased it. And only rode it 3 miles ! I'll keep you folks posted on the outcome.

I cant help thinking, that any kind of transmission problem,is down to heavy use of the toe & heel lever. Some people end up with a bent gear selector fork,and have to strip the motor.I reckon it's down to stamping on the heel part when changing down.That would'nt happen during normal use.Do away the heel part,and just change gear with your toe,like a normal bike.

[recumbentbob]

I don't see how shifting can cause a bevel gear bearing to go out.

[mick56]

Originally Posted by recumbentbob

I don't see how shifting can cause a bevel gear bearing to go out.

I agree.But changing down to 1st gear at anymore than 5mph,is going to cause the clutch,and gearbox problems.With an original clutch set up,it should just slip.If the bike has a Barnetts,and Judges washers,it may have had enough resistance to rip the teeth off the bevel gear cog ?

[DragonLady58]

Its not the heel toe shifter, get rough with that and you'll bend a shifter fork.
Riding style is what hammers that front angel drive. Rough clutch letout while down shifting, dumping the clutch on take off, but the #1 cause is letting off the throttle fast at lower speeds then suddenly snapping the throttle open....like merging into slower traffic thats backed up.
That huge hi torque engine yanking on that 800+ lbs. bikes weight....thats the reason slipper function on the clutch and the huge spring/ratchet mech. on the front of the angle drive.
Now, I've been into many a trans. in my 25+ years being a dealership certified mechanic....these safety features are addressing the damage issue, not the cause.
If kawa had put heavy duty bearings in the angle drive with a heavy duty case, both those features would not be needed.
Chain bikes have a cushion in the rear hub to protect from this. The belted bikes don't have this problem. Now the shaft driven Vulcans have the slipper clutch, the takeup spring on the front of the angle drive, PLUS, a cushion in the rear wheel to keep all the yanking and jerking from destroying the trans. And drive train. Its a design flaw, just like the thru hole on the clutch pushrod seal,and a couple of othet short comings....
How many GoldWings, BMWs, MotoGuzzis yank out the bearings outta their angle drives? Very fraking few....because their stuff is made to prevent it in the first place. The 1500s/1600s have so much torque it'll shred bearings with these features....
I don't have a slipper clutch on both my 1500&1600 hotrod engines, I clutch my bike to keep from yanking the bearings outta my angle drive....
There were some guys at Sturgis talking schit about the Nomads.....I held my front brake on, eased out on the clutch, while applying throttle, smoked the rear tire on up thru4th gear, then drove away while smoking the tire, then clutched it before my rear tire hooked up. Needless to say, thry shut the hell up and were impressed....
That stunt killed my angle drive bearing, so I had to change it when I got home....
Both my 1500/1600 hotrod engines have the Thunder 6 spring clutch, just like the Harley Davidsons....so I have to pamper them some to keep the angle drive bearings happy and safe....
In my honest opinion, the belts offer great safety for both the rider and the engine/drivetrain.....

[ponch]

Originally Posted by DragonLady58

How many GoldWings, BMWs, MotoGuzzis yank out the bearings outta their angle drives? Very fraking few....because their stuff is made to prevent it in the first place. The 1500s/1600s have so much torque it'll shred bearings with these features...

BMWs, Gold wings and Moto Guzzi's don't have bevel drives or gears because the engines have longitudinal crankshafts. The output of the engines are in line with the driveshaft. BMW has had it's share of final drive issues.

[DragonLady58]

Originally Posted by ponch

BMWs, Gold wings and Moto Guzzi's don't have bevel drives or gears because the engines have longitudinal crankshafts. The output of the engines are in line with the driveshaft. BMW has had it's share of final drive issues.

You are correct, but their angle drive is rear based. Yes, there are alot of rear ends connected to driveshafts, but the rears are designed to absorb alot of punishment and shock. The weak link in the vulcan line is that angle drive. Even on their race bikes, few to never a 90 degree drive problem (BMW has had a few, but the % is nowhere as many as the Vulcans in thier rear drives)....Moto Guzzi, even Laverda had a big VTwin like the Guzzis waaay back in the day).
Though the GoldWings never were raced outright, they are about to go 500K, with pratically -0- fails on their rears.
Yes, the rears are alot heavier built. What I am saying is there are a lot of Vulcan/Harley style VTwins out there....(Honda VTX & the 750s-1100s, the Suzuki C50s/C90s, etc. that have drive shafts, and they don't have the problem with their angle drives)
Wanna talk punishment?
YAMA VMAX......130+ horses, capable of blowing away most production superbikes, 10 second 1/4 mile times, straight off the showroon floor, a little tuning and some light mods, 150+ horses, can blow a driveshaft before their AngleDrive.....
What I'm getting at, the big vulcans, had the huge engines, they should have redesigned the angle drives with heavier bearings, extra oil flow, and better reliability.
Honda, yamaha, suzuki had problems, the engineers are updating it in the next years models.
Look at the plastic oil gear. Replaced after 2 years.....MaKawa knew of the angle drive problems by 2004....it was marginal....they wanted to sell replacement parts. They saved updates for the newer models....

[ponch]

Originally Posted by DragonLady58

You are correct, but their angle drive is rear based. Yes, there are alot of rear ends connected to driveshafts, but the rears are designed to absorb alot of punishment and shock. The weak link in the vulcan line is that angle drive. Even on their race bikes, few to never a 90 degree drive problem (BMW has had a few, but the % is nowhere as many as the Vulcans in thier rear drives)....Moto Guzzi, even Laverda had a big VTwin like the Guzzis waaay back in the day).
Though the GoldWings never were raced outright, they are about to go 500K, with pratically -0- fails on their rears.
Yes, the rears are alot heavier built. What I am saying is there are a lot of Vulcan/Harley style VTwins out there....(Honda VTX & the 750s-1100s, the Suzuki C50s/C90s, etc. that have drive shafts, and they don't have the problem with their angle drives)
Wanna talk punishment?
YAMA VMAX......130+ horses, capable of blowing away most production superbikes, 10 second 1/4 mile times, straight off the showroon floor, a little tuning and some light mods, 150+ horses, can blow a driveshaft before their AngleDrive.....
What I'm getting at, the big vulcans, had the huge engines, they should have redesigned the angle drives with heavier bearings, extra oil flow, and better reliability.
Honda, yamaha, suzuki had problems, the engineers are updating it in the next years models.
Look at the plastic oil gear. Replaced after 2 years.....MaKawa knew of the angle drive problems by 2004....it was marginal....they wanted to sell replacement parts. They saved updates for the newer models....

By your definition, all shaft drives have an angle drive in the final drive, even the nomad, which has two, by your definition, with one on the engine side. Thing is, the final drive in the Nomad isn't the weak point as far as I know. BMWs have problems with the unit bearing on the hub. Pre hexhead, it was a shimming issue, later ones it was poor sealed bearings, so the FD oil has no impact on it. There is no cush drive on BMWs and up until the camheads, had a dry clutch on the boxers. Newer liquid cooled boxers have a wet clutch. That said, Gold Wings have a much heavier duty bearing setup and they don't fail. My point is that with shaft drive, keeping the power flow straight with just the 90˚ in the final drive itself is the best way to go. That's not possible with cruiser style V-Twins. Belt would work better, but belts are expensive to replace and when they break, you're stranded. They also don't hold up well if you ride on gravel roads a lot. The small pebbles damage them. I've also heard of Kawasaki's having problems with their belt drives and the nut on the front sprocket losening and the shaft getting chewed up. The problem with the big four is that they are made to a price point which will be evident with some parts of a bike, particularly as they age and then try to get parts when they get beyond a certain age.

[MAS Tequila]

I believe that it's a lack of oil issue.

It's at the end of the line, and bathed in engine oil for lubrication.

The output shaft is connected to the FBGD with a spring loaded cam.

It can absorb a lot of shock.

[DragonLady58]

Totally Agree with you Ponch....the engineering lacks in certain areas....Angle Drive, Ring and Pinion, tomato~tomoto....
The Bearings in the 90 Degree angle drive, if they were heavier, and the oiling to them improved, we'd never have a problem with them. Almost every one that has some miles under its belt, that comes in to the shop, thats never had the bearings changed, shows alot of wear, even if taken care of and babied. But....all in all, the Nomads are Fantastic bikes!

On A Lighter note....you should have seen me adapting a S10 Rearend to that Nomad building a trike. Driveshaft was only 12" long with a dual sprocket, then supported by a pillar block bearing at the very end....then on the driveshaft to the rearend, on centerline at the drive end had a jackshaft, supported by pillarblock bearings....The 2 driveshafts were connected by a doublerow chain.
Talk about fun....Then there was the rotation issue....guy that bought it loves it though. Hope I never have to work on it again. Thank God he's down in South Ca....

[Ironraven]

Here's a still of the damn thing, just in case the link to the video doesn't load.

[gmartin]

How many miles are on this bike?

[mick56]

Originally Posted by Ironraven

Here's a still of the damn thing, just in case the link to the video doesn't load.

The lack of a reply, tells me that nobody has replaced one of these yet.

[MAS Tequila]

I had one of these go out on a 1600.

The bearing had come apart, so it came out easily.

If you pull the piece off that hides the balls, it's a bit delicate, but you can get a very small 2 jaw puller on it.

[Ironraven]

Originally Posted by MAS Tequila

I had one of these go out on a 1600.

The bearing had come apart, so it came out easily.

If you pull the piece off that hides the balls, it's a bit delicate, but you can get a very small 2 jaw puller on it.

So yank the center bit off? I'll give that a shot.