Battery/Electrical issue

[BeardedGrappler504]

Hey guys, so the other day I was in a rush, and I left the ignition on for a few hours. Jumped it from my brothers truck, and ever since then I've been having problems keeping the bike running. After charging the battery for a short while, I was able to ride for a few miles and then bike started to bog down and die. Has done that several times. Cant ride more than a mile or two before it dies. Have tried charging the battery with a trickle charger, still nothing. One thing that is constant though is the speedo wont work. While riding, the speedo never moves. If I hit the turn signal, the speedo will dance and signals will flicker erratically. Any hints? Battery shot? Bad stator? checked all my fuses, they're all good. See attached video to see what the speedo does when i hit the turn signal and rev the motor a bit.

[scooter1600]

revs sound too low

[Peg]

See this recent thread, by andyvh1959, titled Jump start no-no's

Was your brother's truck running?

[BeardedGrappler504]

It’s always had a pretty low idle, but in the last 6 months of riding it has never died because of it.

For reference, this was how the idle sounded a few months ago

https://youtube.com/shorts/_a6mX3FA_EU

[BeardedGrappler504]

Was your brother's truck running?

Well, after reading that thread you posted. Unfortunately for me, it was running.

[plumber63]

To me it looks as the battery is weak. And the bike isn't charging it. If you can keep it running check the voltage at the battery. Even at idle it should be above 13. If you can get it to rev up 14+
As for low idle clean the throttle body and butterflies with carb cleaner or sea foam and a stiff brush.

[BeardedGrappler504]

Originally Posted by plumber63

To me it looks as the battery is weak. And the bike isn't charging it. If you can keep it running check the voltage at the battery. Even at idle it should be above 13. If you can get it to rev up 14+
As for low idle clean the throttle body and butterflies with carb cleaner or sea foam and a stiff brush.

I brought the battery to a shop, guy said it was dead. So I picked up a 20CH, 270CCA battery. Hooked it up, 12.79v. Started the bike, checked again and it maintained 12.3-12.4v. It never went up from there. Even at idle and slight rev, the battery stayed at 12.35. Turn signal still flickered, and speedo needle was still dancing.

I pulled the stator out, and checked for continuity on the stator side of the plug, didnt have any issues there. No open lines. I suppose next step is to check rectifier?

[Sabre-t]

Originally Posted by BeardedGrappler504

I brought the battery to a shop, guy said it was dead. So I picked up a 20CH, 270CCA battery. Hooked it up, 12.79v. Started the bike, checked again and it maintained 12.3-12.4v. It never went up from there. Even at idle and slight rev, the battery stayed at 12.35. Turn signal still flickered, and speedo needle was still dancing.

I pulled the stator out, and checked for continuity on the stator side of the plug, didnt have any issues there. No open lines. I suppose next step is to check rectifier?

You don't have to pull the stator to test it. In fact, you should test it in the bike in order to test it's output. Here is a link to a generic troubleshooting guide for checking the charging system(stator and rectifier/regulator): https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/10...29069374954073
The service manual for your bike with have tests that are more specific to the bike. I recommend that you get a copy if you are going to do your own wrenching.

[ldhthept]

“I brought the battery to a shop…” No. No you didnt. YouTOOK the battery to the shop.

[andyvh1959]

Grammar aside, if the voltage is that low at idle and does not increase with the throttle, it sounds like the voltage regulator is shot. The voltage rectifier changes the AC signal from the three sectors of the stator output to DC. Since you get 12.3v DC from the bike running it seems the rectifier is ok. But these days bikes usually have a combined regulator/rectifier, so you'd just replace both of them. While into the bike, check over the wiring harness for anything that looks or sounds "crisp" indicating a failed insulation and a possible short in the system (flickering lights, speedo not responding). If you have a manual, there are tests in it to check the basic function of the speedo off the bike, like getting the speedo needle to sweep when it powers up.

The way the speedo needle jumps in unison to the turn signal to me indicates a fault short on a shared ground, or a new ground that developed as a result of a short. The speedo on the Nomad and Classic have a lot of connected functions to the turn signal control, the self cancelling control, the speed sensor at the tranny output bearing, the engine ECU, and other functions. There are a lot of shared grounds too. Hate to say it but you have a lot of wiring to go through to find possible faults or shorts, in addition to the likely rectifier/regulator issue.

When you jumped it I assume you just connected the jumper cables to the positive and negative at the battery? Any chance the positive jumper clamp touched the frame or other metal on the bike when you jumped it? On a bike if I'd jump it from another vehicle, that vehicle is turned off, and I'd attach the ground jumper to the frame or engine, and just hold the positive jumper against the positive post, then try to crank the bike. If anything bad results its easy to pull the positive jumper away immediately. Or clamp the positive jumper there and let the other battery induce some charge into the battery before removing the positive jumper and then try to crank over the bike. But once it started, did the speedo act up like in the video immediately? Or did it start up and act normal at first and then acted up after you rode the bike some miles? Again, to me that would indicate some possible wiring fault or short that got worse from the vibes of the bike running and rolling down the road.

[BeardedGrappler504]

Originally Posted by andyvh1959

Grammar aside, if the voltage is that low at idle and does not increase with the throttle, it sounds like the voltage regulator is shot. The voltage rectifier changes the AC signal from the three sectors of the stator output to DC. Since you get 12.3v DC from the bike running it seems the rectifier is ok. But these days bikes usually have a combined regulator/rectifier, so you'd just replace both of them. While into the bike, check over the wiring harness for anything that looks or sounds "crisp" indicating a failed insulation and a possible short in the system (flickering lights, speedo not responding). If you have a manual, there are tests in it to check the basic function of the speedo off the bike, like getting the speedo needle to sweep when it powers up.

The way the speedo needle jumps in unison to the turn signal to me indicates a fault short on a shared ground, or a new ground that developed as a result of a short. The speedo on the Nomad and Classic have a lot of connected functions to the turn signal control, the self cancelling control, the speed sensor at the tranny output bearing, the engine ECU, and other functions. There are a lot of shared grounds too. Hate to say it but you have a lot of wiring to go through to find possible faults or shorts, in addition to the likely rectifier/regulator issue.

When you jumped it I assume you just connected the jumper cables to the positive and negative at the battery? Any chance the positive jumper clamp touched the frame or other metal on the bike when you jumped it? On a bike if I'd jump it from another vehicle, that vehicle is turned off, and I'd attach the ground jumper to the frame or engine, and just hold the positive jumper against the positive post, then try to crank the bike. If anything bad results its easy to pull the positive jumper away immediately. Or clamp the positive jumper there and let the other battery induce some charge into the battery before removing the positive jumper and then try to crank over the bike. But once it started, did the speedo act up like in the video immediately? Or did it start up and act normal at first and then acted up after you rode the bike some miles? Again, to me that would indicate some possible wiring fault or short that got worse from the vibes of the bike running and rolling down the road.

Sorry for the delayed reply. I've been waiting on parts. I printed out a copy of the 1600 Repair Manual. To answer your questions first, I'm not sure if the pos cable touched the frame. I do recall one of the accessory add-ons neg wire smoking. It was a ground wire for some add-on lights that my dad installed. Since then I have disconnected all of the extra electrical items my dad installed. The only thing connected to the battery terminal is the bikes leads. As far as did the speedo do what its doing immediately, I cant recall. I was in such a rush because I was running late for an appointment, i didnt pay too much attention.

As far as what we've done so far: We've tested the stator. We're getting proper vAC and ohm readings. We tested both rectifiers. One gives good readings, one gives bad. We replaced both. Even having replaced both rectifier/regulators, the battery Volts still dont go up when running the bike at 3k RPM. One thing my friend noticed is that the 3 yellow wires that go from the rectifier plug into the stator are getting super hot. He pulled the wires from the harness, and is going to put some new wires in at his shop.(he fixes electrical instruments for a living).

I'm at the point where I'm ready to strip the bike down, and start inspecting the entire wire harness. Any other things to look for would be helpful.

[Sabre-t]

Originally Posted by BeardedGrappler504

Sorry for the delayed reply. I've been waiting on parts. I printed out a copy of the 1600 Repair Manual. To answer your questions first, I'm not sure if the pos cable touched the frame. I do recall one of the accessory add-ons neg wire smoking. It was a ground wire for some add-on lights that my dad installed. Since then I have disconnected all of the extra electrical items my dad installed. The only thing connected to the battery terminal is the bikes leads. As far as did the speedo do what its doing immediately, I cant recall. I was in such a rush because I was running late for an appointment, i didnt pay too much attention.

As far as what we've done so far: We've tested the stator. We're getting proper vAC and ohm readings. We tested both rectifiers. One gives good readings, one gives bad. We replaced both. Even having replaced both rectifier/regulators, the battery Volts still dont go up when running the bike at 3k RPM. One thing my friend noticed is that the 3 yellow wires that go from the rectifier plug into the stator are getting super hot. He pulled the wires from the harness, and is going to put some new wires in at his shop.(he fixes electrical instruments for a living).

I'm at the point where I'm ready to strip the bike down, and start inspecting the entire wire harness. Any other things to look for would be helpful.

Those wires will get quite hot. They are carrying considerable voltage and current. If there is a poor connection in the stator to R/R plug or one or more pins in the plug are corroded or dirty, insufficient current will flow from the stator to the R/R so you will see lower voltage and the plug and possibly the wires could burn up. Running this way will burn out the stator as it will overheat. It can't produce enough current so what would be current to the bike just ends up as heat.

[Kawi_addict]

Well I am not much help but I learned allot reading this thread..... What's your next step? Any update yet?

[BeardedGrappler504]

Originally Posted by Sabre-t

Those wires will get quite hot. They are carrying considerable voltage and current. If there is a poor connection in the stator to R/R plug or one or more pins in the plug are corroded or dirty, insufficient current will flow from the stator to the R/R so you will see lower voltage and the plug and possibly the wires could burn up. Running this way will burn out the stator as it will overheat. It can't produce enough current so what would be current to the bike just ends up as heat.

So we've replaced the wires in the stator harness, larger gauge. Aren't getting as hot. when we pull the wires out of the plastic connector, we're cleaning the corrosion off the connectors.

As of now, we're just chasing wires down. Finding broken/frayed wires. Trying to narrow down where the problem is.

[BeardedGrappler504]

Think this is the problem? Back of fuse panel