Steering Bearing Longevity 41K

H8BUGZ · 10-26-2018, 07:45 PM

My original steering bearings were changed to All Balls at 30,000 miles, despite being good since I was doing a fork oil change. Recently the bike felt like it steered exceptionally easy. I've discovered the steering has that notch type feel. I'm considering going back to OEM bearings if this is the norm. I have installed thousands of tapered bearings in my automotive career and doubt I did anything wrong. In fact, I re-checked the preload at one point since a fork seal had a piece of crud in it and leaked. ANY OPINIONS?

redjay · 10-26-2018, 09:15 PM

AllBalls bearings are rebranded Chinese bearings. Several people on other forums have had issues with AllBalls bearings.

https://www.remotemoto.com/articles/...ngs/review-53/

https://katriders.com/vb/showthread.php?t=133247

mbarr10 · 10-26-2018, 10:59 PM

Quote:

AllBalls bearings are rebranded Chinese bearings. Several people on other forums have had issues with AllBalls bearings.

Interesting, First I have heard of this.

**smokier** · 10-27-2018, 07:47 AM

???

Dang, will have to do more research, as these were on the TO DO list for this Winter...

Ride safe,
Smokier

H8BUGZ · 10-27-2018, 09:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by redjay

AllBalls bearings are rebranded Chinese bearings. Several people on other forums have had issues with AllBalls bearings.

https://www.remotemoto.com/articles/...ngs/review-53/

https://katriders.com/vb/showthread.php?t=133247

I figured as much. Dont remember much in the way of identifying marks on the All Balls. Usually advice on this forum is golden. My guess is, some "enthusiasts" here don't see the kind of mileage I'm speaking about. Does anyone have Timken, GSK or GOOD bearing part numbers? All balls has a marginal cross reference.

recumbentbob · 10-27-2018, 11:18 AM

If you still have the factory bearing you should be able to take it to an industrial bearing supply and they will probably be able to match it.

**Sabre-t** · 10-27-2018, 12:12 PM

Redjay, good to know. For wheel bearings, I would definitely use Kawi or a better quality brand bearing than All Balls wheel bearings, in the future, after reading that. I felt that there was a little too much play in my front wheel when I last changed the tire, and I did replace the bearings with All Balls. I will be keeping a real close eye on those bearings, now.

However, and this is just my opinion, but even if All Balls are cheap Chinese bearings, they are still better than the crappy OEM steering bearings. If all metal steering bearings are properly greased and torqued, they should still last longer and be less prone to catastrophic failure than the OEM bearings.

Again, just my opinion, but the OEM steering bearings are the wrong type for the application. That type of bearing is typically used in high speed, low impact applications. The plastic cage was intact when I replaced mine, but I have seen a number of posts on various forums where the poster described the bearings as falling apart or the cage cracked and missing pieces when they removed the OEM bearings.

gv550 · 10-27-2018, 01:25 PM

On my Voyager the stock ball-type steering bearings were replaced under warranty with OEM bearings, twice in 400k kms. At about 450k I installed Allballs tapered bearings and they were trouble free and are still rolling smoothly for the new owner at 690k.
I maintained both bearing types the same way, removing the stem and cleaning, regreasing, and torquing to spec.
There is no justification for condemning Allballs simply because they may be made in China. It is possible to get good quality from China, as many brand name bearing companies have manufacturing plants there. I think the fact that the tapered roller bearings have a large contact line rather than the spot contact of a ball bearing makes them more suitable for this low speed, high impact application.
In the link that Redjay posted, they were wheel bearing failures that the poster admitted were caused by a seal failure resulting in rust damage to the bearings. On our bikes, the wheel bearings have non-contact seals, and there are separate spring loaded lip type seals beyond both bearings. If you replace and maintain those seals regularly (as I did) the bearings will run forever regardless of where they were made.

Peg · 10-27-2018, 05:43 PM

The All Balls steering head bearings I installed on my 800 had to be replaced within a couple of years due to seal failure. That was my fault, through poor installation, and I've since replaced steering head bearings on my Nomad and Voyager with All Balls bearings, without any problem arising. In both cases the change completely eliminated minor head-shake on deceleration, and improved handling.

So I'll remain loyal to All Balls.

H8BUGZ · 10-27-2018, 09:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gv550

On our bikes, the wheel bearings have non-contact seals, and there are separate spring loaded lip type seals beyond both bearings. If you replace and maintain those seals regularly (as I did) the bearings will run forever regardless of where they were made.

Accurate description about the front wheel seals and bearings, until you begin believing well maintained seals, will make a bearing last "FOREVER".

mbarr10 · 10-28-2018, 11:34 AM

Quote:

I think the fact that the tapered roller bearings have a large contact line rather than the spot contact of a ball bearing makes them more suitable for this low speed, high impact application.

These were my thoughts all along. But not from actual knowledge, just made sense. Still does make sense regardless of the manufacturer or region of manufacture.

Quote:

will make a bearing last "FOREVER"

FOREVER = the life of the bike, that is forever to me. Who does a million miles besides 1 or 2 Goldwing riders.

DragonLady58 · 10-28-2018, 03:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by H8BUGZ

I figured as much. Dont remember much in the way of identifying marks on the All Balls. Usually advice on this forum is golden. My guess is, some "enthusiasts" here don't see the kind of mileage I'm speaking about. Does anyone have Timken, GSK or GOOD bearing part numbers? All balls has a marginal cross reference.

All you have to do is have them do a cross reference....to get their New Numbers.

H8BUGZ · 10-28-2018, 08:24 PM

I didn't really condemn All Balls, I just agreed they may be inferior quality being from China. Turns out water ruined my lower bearing. I used OEM Kawasaki seals with the tapered bearings. As the All Balls seals looked cheap/marginal to me. I see no reason OEM should not work with tapered bearings, but will compare when all my parts get here (both roller and tapered on order).

Peg · 10-28-2018, 08:39 PM

I'd suggest you don't mix the All Balls bearings with OEM seals... I did the same thing with the first set I put on my 800, with exactly the same result as yours. I've used All Balls seals ever since, and had no further problem.

H8BUGZ · 10-28-2018, 09:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peg

I'd suggest you don't mix the All Balls bearings with OEM seals... I did the same thing with the first set I put on my 800, with exactly the same result as yours. I've used All Balls seals ever since, and had no further problem.

Peg, do you remember if the All Balls seal lip rides around the outside of the neck tube. I remember the inner dimension being too big for the steering stem and no way to center it when pressing the lower bearing on. From what I see on their website, looks like maybe it's centered by the bearing cage when pressed on. The top All Balls seal looks the same, but Kawasaki has a much thicker plastic clad rubber seal that snaps on the adjusting nut. Doesn't add up for me now. Hope it makes more sense when I get the parts Wednesday.

10-26-2018, 07:45 PM	#1
H8BUGZ Member Join Date: Mar 2014 Location: Midwest Posts: 273	Steering Bearing Longevity 41K My original steering bearings were changed to All Balls at 30,000 miles, despite being good since I was doing a fork oil change. Recently the bike felt like it steered exceptionally easy. I've discovered the steering has that notch type feel. I'm considering going back to OEM bearings if this is the norm. I have installed thousands of tapered bearings in my automotive career and doubt I did anything wrong. In fact, I re-checked the preload at one point since a fork seal had a piece of crud in it and leaked. ANY OPINIONS? Login or Register to Remove Ads Last edited by H8BUGZ; 10-26-2018 at 07:48 PM.
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10-27-2018, 07:47 AM	#4
smokier Join Date: May 2015 Location: DBQ Iowa Posts: 1,807	What MBarr said... ??? Dang, will have to do more research, as these were on the TO DO list for this Winter... Ride safe, Smokier
	0

10-27-2018, 11:18 AM	#6
recumbentbob Sr. Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Newburgh IN Posts: 3,404	If you still have the factory bearing you should be able to take it to an industrial bearing supply and they will probably be able to match it. __________________ VBA #01084 "A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the People to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."
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10-27-2018, 01:25 PM	#8
gv550 Advanced Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Listowel, Ontario Posts: 642	On my Voyager the stock ball-type steering bearings were replaced under warranty with OEM bearings, twice in 400k kms. At about 450k I installed Allballs tapered bearings and they were trouble free and are still rolling smoothly for the new owner at 690k. I maintained both bearing types the same way, removing the stem and cleaning, regreasing, and torquing to spec. There is no justification for condemning Allballs simply because they may be made in China. It is possible to get good quality from China, as many brand name bearing companies have manufacturing plants there. I think the fact that the tapered roller bearings have a large contact line rather than the spot contact of a ball bearing makes them more suitable for this low speed, high impact application. In the link that Redjay posted, they were wheel bearing failures that the poster admitted were caused by a seal failure resulting in rust damage to the bearings. On our bikes, the wheel bearings have non-contact seals, and there are separate spring loaded lip type seals beyond both bearings. If you replace and maintain those seals regularly (as I did) the bearings will run forever regardless of where they were made. __________________ Garry 2009 1700 Voyager KACT, sold at 679,465 kms 2011 1700 Nomad Improve handling, suspension and tire life with Garry's Fork Brace. PM for details.
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10-27-2018, 05:43 PM	#9
Peg Sr. Member Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: West Coast, North Island, New Zealand Posts: 1,375	The All Balls steering head bearings I installed on my 800 had to be replaced within a couple of years due to seal failure. That was my fault, through poor installation, and I've since replaced steering head bearings on my Nomad and Voyager with All Balls bearings, without any problem arising. In both cases the change completely eliminated minor head-shake on deceleration, and improved handling. So I'll remain loyal to All Balls. __________________ Nothing screams poor workmanship like wrinkles in the duct tape '02 1500 blonde Nomad (Sold) '97 800 burgundy Classic (Sold)
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10-26-2018, 09:15 PM	#2
redjay Top Contributor Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Ontario Posts: 6,942	AllBalls bearings are rebranded Chinese bearings. Several people on other forums have had issues with AllBalls bearings. https://www.remotemoto.com/articles/...ngs/review-53/ https://katriders.com/vb/showthread.php?t=133247
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10-27-2018, 12:12 PM	#7
Sabre-t Join Date: May 2015 Location: Marietta, GA Posts: 838	Redjay, good to know. For wheel bearings, I would definitely use Kawi or a better quality brand bearing than All Balls wheel bearings, in the future, after reading that. I felt that there was a little too much play in my front wheel when I last changed the tire, and I did replace the bearings with All Balls. I will be keeping a real close eye on those bearings, now. However, and this is just my opinion, but even if All Balls are cheap Chinese bearings, they are still better than the crappy OEM steering bearings. If all metal steering bearings are properly greased and torqued, they should still last longer and be less prone to catastrophic failure than the OEM bearings. Again, just my opinion, but the OEM steering bearings are the wrong type for the application. That type of bearing is typically used in high speed, low impact applications. The plastic cage was intact when I replaced mine, but I have seen a number of posts on various forums where the poster described the bearings as falling apart or the cage cracked and missing pieces when they removed the OEM bearings.
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10-28-2018, 08:39 PM	#14
Peg Sr. Member Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: West Coast, North Island, New Zealand Posts: 1,375	I'd suggest you don't mix the All Balls bearings with OEM seals... I did the same thing with the first set I put on my 800, with exactly the same result as yours. I've used All Balls seals ever since, and had no further problem. __________________ Nothing screams poor workmanship like wrinkles in the duct tape '02 1500 blonde Nomad (Sold) '97 800 burgundy Classic (Sold)
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