New Kawasaki Policy?

[Kedosto]

Originally Posted by ponch

My job as it were, isn't to keep any dealer in business, it's to get the best deal. If it's $2-3K, where is that money better off? In my pocket. Like I said, the world is getting smaller and with the internet, these policies are collusion to stave off reality. Change is coming and the uncompetative don't like it.

Unfortunately, the $2-3k discount deal doesn't happen. It never does. There just isn't that much margin. But as the customer you're saying you'd be happy to get the run-around anyway?

I understand you want to get the best deal possible, and agree that you're not responsible for the dealers survival, but are you willing to deal with the BS only to save what will almost certainly be a few bucks than work out an honest deal with the local dealer? Remember, in just about every instance the local guy could have given you the same deal, he just didn't lie right to your face to get you in the door.

I don't perceive any "collusion" going on here, but rather a sense of brand protection and customer respect from Kawasaki protecting us from less than fair dealers.

Maybe.

Kevin

[Top Cat]

Originally Posted by ponch

I love Canadians...

Really? The ones I know are mediocre at best.

[ponch]

Originally Posted by Kedosto

Unfortunately, the $2-3k discount deal doesn't happen. It never does. There just isn't that much margin. But as the customer you're saying you'd be happy to get the run-around anyway?

I understand you want to get the best deal possible, and agree that you're not responsible for the dealers survival, but are you willing to deal with the BS only to save what will almost certainly be a few bucks than work out an honest deal with the local dealer? Remember, in just about every instance the local guy could have given you the same deal, he just didn't lie right to your face to get you in the door.

I don't perceive any "collusion" going on here, but rather a sense of brand protection and customer respect from Kawasaki protecting us from less than fair dealers.

Maybe.

Kevin

For all I know you work for Kawasaki or a dealer as you make no sense. There are folks on here that have gotten deals 2-3K below list, so you are mistaken. Secondly, we are not direct customers of Kawasaki, the dealers are and we are the potential customers of the dealers. If Kawasaki is making a change, it is not for our benefit, but for the dealers.

[ponch]

Originally Posted by Top Cat

Really? The ones I know are mediocre at best.

Mediocre at what?

[ringadingh]

Originally Posted by Top Cat

Really? The ones I know are mediocre at best.

Youve never met a good one yet!

[Monkeyman]

Something to keep in mind is service after the sale. In a perfect world, all service departments would wait on you with the same attention regardless of whether you bought the bike there or not. In the real world, it just doesn't happen that way (or at least not very often). If you're only going to save a grand or so, it might be worth it to shop locally.

[ponch]

Originally Posted by Monkeyman

Something to keep in mind is service after the sale. In a perfect world, all service departments would wait on you with the same attention regardless of whether you bought the bike there or not. In the real world, it just doesn't happen that way (or at least not very often). If you're only going to save a grand or so, it might be worth it to shop locally.

I'd only use service for warranty issues. Dealers have to fix warranty issues, if there are any. That said, we were talking 2-3K.

[Monkeyman]

I'm assuming that means that you do your own work. Some of us have to farm stuff out once in a while. Even with warranty work, you could get stuck waiting in line or you might get to go to the front of the line. Or maybe you have an odd work schedule and they have to fit you in at an odd time. Or maybe instead of wiping the spilled oil off the bike (as they're "required" to do), they go the extra mile and wash it for you. Or maybe they make you an extra key once in a while if you lose yours. I could go on and on. It's all about the little things. Some places (seems like the bigger shops) don't care much about loyalty as they get all the business they can handle one way or another. Some of the smaller businesses really appreciate a return customer. I used to take my Fiero to the same mid size shop (dealer) all the time. I refused to go anywhere else. They charged me the "frequent flyer" rate and worked around my schedule (even had a mechanic come in on a Saturday evening to fix something once). If I needed a little something extra, they'd make sure I had it, sometimes free of charge. I know a few parts I got at cost. They knew, if they treated me right, they'd get my business forever. I took all my vehicles there until they went out of business. (GM took their dealership away.) Maybe times are changing (for the worse) and nobody cares about loyalty anymore.

A difference of 3 grand is alot but maybe it's worth it depending on the price of the bike. I guess it might matter if you're buying a $15k bike. Not so much if you're paying $30k. For that $3k difference, you might be able to convince the dealer to give you a couple thousand in free parts or something. Maybe some sort of free upgrade or a voucher for clothes? I know HD does this alot. I visit Brandt's HD in Wabash, IN on a semi regular basis. Their current deal is $2k in freebies if you buy a new bike. They used to have a deal where you'd get a free wash/detail once a month (or something like that). Their prices seem to run a bit higher than some other dealers but once you figure everything into it, it was pretty close.

[Kedosto]

Ponch: "If Kawasaki is making a change, it is not for our benefit, but for the dealers."

Ah, but it is for our benefit. Indirectly. Specifically it's a benefit for the dealers which translates to a benefit for us.

I'm pretty sure Kawasaki would rather have a vast network of quality, reliable dealerships ready to provide a long term customer service relationship, than a handful of slime-ball, lying cheats eager to lure us into their dealership by whatever means necessary and then stick it to us for a quick buck. Though I guess I could be wrong.

Monkeyman: "If you're only going to save a grand or so, it might be worth it to shop locally."

Exactly. I may not want to be that generous ($1k!), but you've hit at the heart of the issue. Every guy on this board wants a solid, quality, reputable local dealer that's ready to meet their needs, but if we don't support them how can we expect them to be there for us?

But hey, I could be wrong. I don't work for Kawasaki or a dealership. Perhaps it is a multi-national, multi-state, highly organized effort of collusion and deception aimed at swindling us out of our money. Maybe that's a better way to build a solid brand with a quality reputation.

Enjoy the ride!

Kevin

[ponch]

Originally Posted by Kedosto

Ponch: "If Kawasaki is making a change, it is not for our benefit, but for the dealers."

Ah, but it is for our benefit. Indirectly. Specifically it's a benefit for the dealers which translates to a benefit for us.

I'm pretty sure Kawasaki would rather have a vast network of quality, reliable dealerships ready to provide a long term customer service relationship, than a handful of slime-ball, lying cheats eager to lure us into their dealership by whatever means necessary and then stick it to us for a quick buck. Though I guess I could be wrong.

Monkeyman: "If you're only going to save a grand or so, it might be worth it to shop locally."

Exactly. I may not want to be that generous ($1k!), but you've hit at the heart of the issue. Every guy on this board wants a solid, quality, reputable local dealer that's ready to meet their needs, but if we don't support them how can we expect them to be there for us?

But hey, I could be wrong. I don't work for Kawasaki or a dealership. Perhaps it is a multi-national, multi-state, highly organized effort of collusion and deception aimed at swindling us out of our money. Maybe that's a better way to build a solid brand with a quality reputation.

Enjoy the ride!

Kevin

Competitive and different prices don't dictate quality. The dealers don't make the bikes, they just sell them. Just because a margin is higher doesn't make a bike or anything else better.

It's collusion as there must be enough dealers that complained about it and furthermore, if these dealers that undercut were that unscrupulous, their reputation would be known and they'd lose sales. The fact that enough dealers complained for Kawasaki to make a change means they must have been undercutting competitors quite a bit.

[ponch]

Originally Posted by Monkeyman

I'm assuming that means that you do your own work. Some of us have to farm stuff out once in a while. Even with warranty work, you could get stuck waiting in line or you might get to go to the front of the line. Or maybe you have an odd work schedule and they have to fit you in at an odd time. Or maybe instead of wiping the spilled oil off the bike (as they're "required" to do), they go the extra mile and wash it for you. Or maybe they make you an extra key once in a while if you lose yours. I could go on and on. It's all about the little things. Some places (seems like the bigger shops) don't care much about loyalty as they get all the business they can handle one way or another. Some of the smaller businesses really appreciate a return customer. I used to take my Fiero to the same mid size shop (dealer) all the time. I refused to go anywhere else. They charged me the "frequent flyer" rate and worked around my schedule (even had a mechanic come in on a Saturday evening to fix something once). If I needed a little something extra, they'd make sure I had it, sometimes free of charge. I know a few parts I got at cost. They knew, if they treated me right, they'd get my business forever. I took all my vehicles there until they went out of business. (GM took their dealership away.) Maybe times are changing (for the worse) and nobody cares about loyalty anymore.

A difference of 3 grand is alot but maybe it's worth it depending on the price of the bike. I guess it might matter if you're buying a $15k bike. Not so much if you're paying $30k. For that $3k difference, you might be able to convince the dealer to give you a couple thousand in free parts or something. Maybe some sort of free upgrade or a voucher for clothes? I know HD does this alot. I visit Brandt's HD in Wabash, IN on a semi regular basis. Their current deal is $2k in freebies if you buy a new bike. They used to have a deal where you'd get a free wash/detail once a month (or something like that). Their prices seem to run a bit higher than some other dealers but once you figure everything into it, it was pretty close.

Attitudes like that will drive a dealer out of business. When I worked in an independent Apple shop, I didn't care where a customer bought their computer when they brought it in for repair. Their money was green and so was Apple's for warranty repairs. Anything else is self-serving egotism and small mindedness and businesses as such will not last.

As far as freebees (I can't buy off the rack anyway), I could care less. I don't ride a HD and no big four shop here offers such things. They do however try to sell expensive service contracts at sale, which adds to the list price.

What it comes down to is I see dealers the same way I do shopping for food or any other consumable. I don't care about Hy Vee for instance or that I need to have a relationship with them to buy my food. I give them money for what they sell, so there is consideration.