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Old 08-27-2017, 06:59 AM   #1
gleam   gleam is offline
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Help with setting price for '99 Nomad with bad engine

Hello, VBF. I was hoping to finish my series of build threads on this bike before I told the end of the story, but my circumstances are changing and I've gotta do this out of sequence. I'm going to have to repeat a few things so if you've followed along, please bear with me. Part 2 is about halfway done and I plan on posting it eventually.

The gist of what happened was that I was initially lied to by the previous owner about the plastic oil gear (POG) being fixed under warranty. Turns out it wasn't and on top of that I now suspect the entire engine was from a scrap yard. I had no reason to suspect he was lying becuase he was the original owner, so it didn't make sense that he didn't get it fixed under warranty. The only thing I can think of is that maybe in Canada it wasn't as easy to get it fixed for some reason. Unfortunately for me, I didn't find or figure all this out until I was very deep into this project. The bike was up on a jack as pictured in previous threads (linked below), and as you know, that meant I wasn't able to pull the motor until I had the wheels back on.

With the short riding season quickly evaporating, I decided to take a gamble. I finished everything on the bike except for the POG fix. It was either that or give up on 2016 altogether becuase there just wasn't any time left to do it. I gambled on that plastic gear and lost. I had the bike out about three times after I finished it, and only two of those were what I would call actual rides. I discovered a road I had never been down before, that had been paved the year before so the surface was pristine. It was a beautiful, sunny fall day. Ideal, really. I knew something was wrong immediately and I pulled over right away. It still ran but the top end was very loud and clacky and just didn't sound right at all so I shut it off and trailered it home. It's been in storage ever since, while I made up my mind as to what to do with it. I was hoping to be able to set it aside, and fix the motor over the winter. Since then things have changed, and I probably won't have the work space to do that anymore. I was lookign forward to the challenge but it's just not gonna work out now.

I'm posting this thread to see what you guys think a fair price would be for this, or if I should part it out. I'm offering the Nomad to anyone from the forum who wants it first before I list it for sale. If someone has one of the engines that fit this laying around, or wants to fix this one, this bike will be a great deal. I've already gone through everything else almost. However, if you don't have a source on one, I can't recommend buying this unless you want it for parts. I couldn't find a motor in Canada, and everyone I talked to said these motors are rare because of the POG issue, and becuase the demographic that owns these bikes tends not to wreck them. I was able to find one on eBay but it was almost $3,000 CAD by the time I got it here. Not really worth it.

If nobody wants it, I'm going to take it apart and keep what I can reasonably store and manage and put the parts up for sale. I'll keep all the valuable stuff like the body, bags, carbs, forks, and so on that I'm able to physically store. I don't know what to do with the rest of it, so I'd appreciate if anyone knows where I can scrap it in Nova Scotia.

The Good
Body and Paint: excellent condition. There's a tiny rock chip on the tank, and a couple tiny ones on the front fender. Everything was compounded and polished by hand, even the bags. I took the handles off the bags in order to polish it properly, so the hole is already drilled for anyone else who wants to do that again.
Carburetor: rebuilt with DynoJet kit and a few new parts. Diaphragm is original but in good condition.
Exhaust: Vance and Hines in great condition. The rear header issue has be taken care of. I had it welded as can be seen in previous threads and Part 2 of the build will cover this in more detail. The baffles were rusted into place, and I was able to get them out (in an interesting way), paint them, and rewrap them. The heat shields were falling off so I wrapped the headers in black wrap. This won't be to everyone's taste, but it was painstakingly done, and I think it looks great, personally. It could be undone in seconds and the heat shields put back on if you fix the clamps.
Front forks: fully rebuilt with all new parts, new oil, and Progressive Suspension progressive springs. Steering stem bearings replaced.
Electrical: there were several broken solder joints in the fuse box, that I had professionally repaired. I rewrapped the wiring harness with 3M Super 33+. In doing so I found a spot where the harness was rubbing on the frame and had started to rub through one of the wires. Relocated ignition to left side cover.
Seat: I got a used seat that was in perfect condition to replace the one that came on it.
Controls: new clutch cable (open side, close side is not available anymore)
Lights: replaced Kawi light bar with a stock turn signals one from eBay
Extras: comes with all the stock setup I took off to make it solo: windshield, lowers, seat, etc. See picture of when I first got it. I've also got a bunch of leftover OEM parts I bought but didn't use yet.

The Bad
Engine: oil pump failed while riding and the engine ran for about a minute or two before I was able to shut it off.
Front Brakes: I could never get them to bleed properly. I got another caliper off of eBay and it did the same thing. It seems like air is getting past the threads on the bleed nipple, but I'm not sure. It makes no sense to me that both calipers would do this but I wasn't able to solve this one. I don't consider the brakes to be functional because of this. Rear caliper was rebuilt and works great, though.
Tires: over 10 years old, not usuable, must be replaced.

So that's it I guess. I bought this bike after my accident in 2015, worked on it all year and was able to ride it about three times. The Nomad is a fantastic bike, but this particular one I bought was a lemon and I was too green to be able to see it until it was too late. You really only learn when you struggle against something that's a bit out of your reach, so I'd say I learned quite a bit about buying and working on bikes. I'm looking to go back to something smaller that I can still take on longer trips. Right now I think that will be a Dyna Wide Glide, but I haven't sat on one in person. If anyone has an older one for sale please let me know. Not many of them seem to be for sale in my budget around here.
Thanks for everything, VBF.

Previous threads about this Nomad:
http://www.vulcanbagger.com/forums/s...ad.php?t=44152
http://www.vulcanbagger.com/forums/s...ad.php?t=44133
http://www.vulcanbagger.com/forums/s...ad.php?t=45245
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1999 VN1500 Nomad - Death by POG



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Old 08-27-2017, 07:59 AM   #2
ringadingh   ringadingh is offline
 
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Sorry to hear about you bad luck with this bike. Kawasaki only fixed the oil gear problem if it failed during the ten years they extended the warranty on the oil gear. If the bike wasn't ridden a lot the gear would not fail and therefore it was not replaced.
The motors are not that rare, any nomad or Meanstreak motor will fit, from 1999 to 2008.
I picked up my replacement motor locally from a crashed bike for $1,200.00 cdn.
That is the cheapest easiest route to go, as they are plug and play installations.
Or you can use a Judges oil oil replacement depending on how mechanically inclined you are. This method saves you from splitting the cases and can be done with the motor in the frame. But it depends on whether or not you did any damage to the motor while it ran with the broken pump gear.
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Old 08-27-2017, 08:41 AM   #3
gleam   gleam is offline
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Thanks ringadingh. I've been through all the options to fix it, and I'm not going to be able to do any of them. I was going to split the cases and replace everything properly, but this was last winter and things are much different for me now. I have to move and I don't expect to have any sort of workspace wherever I end up. I didn't know that about it only being fixed under warranty if it broke, maybe that's what happened. I didn't see this until I started working on the bike, but the engine looked like it sat on its own in a scrap yard. It was much more worn looking than the rest of the bike, with paint flaking off the rear. There was a couple numbers painted on the back of it that didn't seem to line up with anything to do with the bike. It looked a lot like inventory numbers from a scrap yard. There were also big gaps in the service records, as well. I got duped becuase I didn't know any better. I asked him specifically about the POG and he said it was fixed. It wasn't.

I've been looking for over a year now for another motor and they're just not out there around here. I even called yards in Quebec becuase I was willing to drive out there to get one, but nobody had any. There's only one yard that I know of in all of the Maritimes.

I spent thousands of dollars over and above what I paid for this bike to do all the work I did on it. If someone says to me that they have an engine somewhere that I can drive to I might change my mind. Then I'd have a running bike that is worth it for someone to buy. But as it stands today I'm not interested in throwing more money at this bike, and I need to cut my losses. I think it's a good deal for someone with the engine, so that's why I'm asking you guys. What would be a fair price for this as it sits now?
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Old 08-27-2017, 12:23 PM   #4
cactusjack   cactusjack is offline
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That's a real shame. It's also a good example of what to watch out for if considering buying a 99 Nomad. I hope things work out as well as possible for you.
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Old 08-27-2017, 01:29 PM   #5
gleam   gleam is offline
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Thanks a lot, appreciate it.

Of course now that I finally decided to sell it, I see a wrecked bike come up for sale. Been looking for a year and never saw one. Will a 2005 Vulcan Classic work as a source for engine? It's a running parts bike so I could get all the electronics, intake and everything with it as well. I'd have to be able to use my Nomad tank though. Really hope someone knows if this will work. If so I might be able to save my Nomad.

You guys said '99 to '08 Nomad or Meanie, but this is a Vulcan Classic. Thanks again.

This seems like an authoritative answer: http://vulcanbagger.com/forums/showp...82&postcount=6

Would like to know for sure if everything will work though, swingarm, motor mounts, etc. I have to drive quite far to get this bike if I'm gonna get it so it would really help to know for sure if everything will interchange.
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Old 08-27-2017, 03:46 PM   #6
MAS Tequila   MAS Tequila is offline
 
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Yes, it will bolt in.

I would keep it carb'd, it is a guaranteed result.


Swapping harnesses and all that goes with that, well I hate electronic gremlins and you'll be giving them an open invitation.

Swapping it in with the carb can be done in a weekend.
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Old 08-27-2017, 04:33 PM   #7
OldSchool   OldSchool is offline
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Be allot easier to just go and buy this one. Even if you are in Canada, there has to be a way for you to get it up to Halifax.



Well the link I had here is no longer valid someone must have bought the bike.
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Old 08-28-2017, 04:25 AM   #8
mick56   mick56 is offline
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Phil Halling found the best way of doing the POG.
"
Just sorted my oil gear out, got the replacement complete with shaft, had the shaft machined off to leave an exact hole the size of the existing shaft, broke the plastic gear off - then heated up the new steel gear and slid it on and put 3 tack welds on it.it was about £55 for the gear and a new RH gasket, then £75 to have it machined and took us 2.5 hrs to do. In my mind a better fix than Judges oil gear and a lot easier than splitting the crankcase or dropping the oil. The only testing bit was stopping the existing shaft from going back into the case a few mm, we got over that by using one of those little round magnets on a car ariel type thing - the magnet was the same diameter as the shaft, so the hot (expanded) new gear just slid down the "ariel" and popped straight onto the shaft.
Pity they dont sell just the gear with a 12mm hole in the centre."
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Old 08-29-2017, 03:03 PM   #9
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Let me just say this guys, yes, alot of people have been misled about a POG. IF, and I say IF, the bike was running, there wasn't any knocking going on, chances you just scraped the hell outta the rod bearings and the crank can be polished and a new set of bearings will cure it, besides a new oil pump. And of course, a set of new mains.
If it were knocking, well, best to go with another motor, Cheaper, but that motor is still rebuildable.
The POG repair is ok if done right, but there isn't any better fix than splitting the cases and having it done with a new pump/gear.
The quick and dirty solution is what MAS told you, a bolt in. Its quick, and its easy and the least painless.
Let me say, however, that the Vulcan Nomad engine isn't all that hard to rebuild. If you've rebuilt a chevy 283 to a 454 sb or bb.... you can easily rebuild the 1500.
Theres alot of small parts, and alot of steps, but you could do it.
I have several motors that I have set back, when the weather is rather nasty in the winter time, I grab one and rebuild it. Pistons w/rings, gaskets, new oil pump, bearings, new lifters, cam chains, looking right at $650....if you shop around to get the best deals....
I realize your unfamiliar with the 05 Classic, but she'll fit and run in the Nomad trim. Or if the 05 Classic is running.....convert her to a Clomad....
Diff./ Custom / Strange is Goooooooooodddddd....
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Old 09-27-2017, 07:26 PM   #10
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Hi Gleam Im new to VBA

I also have a 1999 Nomad and have grinned and bared all the problems that come with this bike including a blow rocker box gasket.I seen a 1999 Nomad engine for sale up here in Ontario on a website called Kijiji and they were looking for $700.00 for that engine.I need to rebuild my engine because 3rd gear is screwed.The local shop here has a guy who builds engines for bike racing teams all over North America.he told me he has a guy in Long Island , New York who is a transmission genius and he can make me a 3rd gear from scratch.I think that's pretty impressive.I was hoping your bike was red on red like mine but I see you have the green on green.I could be very interested in a lot of your stuff .I have discovered that my steering head bearings are also in need of replacing and I need a right hand rear shock.mine wont hold air.So we can do some business for sure.I just bought my bike back for the second time.It was written off by my insurance company after I was T-boned by a drunk in Nov of 2006.I saw it for sale on Kijiji and decided to by it back.So now I'm trying to get it looking and running like it was when I was the previous owner if it.The two clowns that owned it over the last 10 1/2 years did not really know how to properly care for a nice machine.I will be talking to you again ,thanks Nomad Dad (Henry)
 
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Old 10-11-2017, 09:31 AM   #11
bgiants   bgiants is offline
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99 nomad

Do you still have the front forks for this bike?
 
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Old 02-09-2018, 02:32 AM   #12
gleam   gleam is offline
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This bike is for sale. I haven't gotten the post ready, but I have made up my mind so I thought I'd get started.

The whole bike and all the upgrades and parts I bought for it will be for sale as a package first, and failing that I'll part it out.

TL;DR - 1999 Nomad for sale, engine no good

EDIT: I didn't see the last two posts in this thread until just now, sorry about that.
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Old 02-09-2018, 09:15 PM   #13
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I hate reading about things like this. I never have been able to understand how someone could look a potential buyer straight in the eye and lie about it. Happened to me with a boat. The sack of garbage.

Be careful when you buy that Harley. I've had three and they can be troublesome if they weren't take care of properly. Insist on service records. Good luck to you.
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Old 02-10-2018, 04:58 AM   #14
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Thanks, I appreciate that. Even today I still don't fully understand it. Without repeating the whole story (which is in my past threads), he's either lying or was lied to himself. I just thought of something that didn't occur to me before. It's so obvious now that I feel stupid for not putting it together sooner.

Everything seemed fine until I noticed the paint was coming off the under/back side of the engine cases. It was a lot more worn out than the rest of the bike. It also had some numbers written by hand in paint marker on it, like an inventory number. So after that point I was strongly suspicious that the engine was a junkyard swap, but I couldn't figure out why it ended up this way.

The way I saw it at the time, if he was the original owner, he qualified for the free warranty repair. Ironically this is what originally tipped me towards buying this one, since usually original owner is a good thing.

Anyway, it's obvious now to me, and I'm sure to all of you what likely happened. Something happened to the original engine, whether related to the POG or not, it was enough to swap out the whole engine. Somehow this junkyard engine ended up in this bike, and it didn't have the POG fix, which is how I ended up with it.

Neat.

Funny you should mention that about the Harley. I did end up getting one at the very end of the season last year. Got a few rides in, but it was too little too late. The Harley is a great bike, but it's also not for me so it's most likely going up for sale as well. There's just a bit more to think about with that one. It's a 2011 Fat Bob.
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Old 03-03-2018, 07:24 AM   #15
mick56   mick56 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nomad dad View Post
I also have a 1999 Nomad and have grinned and bared all the problems that come with this bike including a blow rocker box gasket.I seen a 1999 Nomad engine for sale up here in Ontario on a website called Kijiji and they were looking for $700.00 for that engine.I need to rebuild my engine because 3rd gear is screwed.The local shop here has a guy who builds engines for bike racing teams all over North America.he told me he has a guy in Long Island , New York who is a transmission genius and he can make me a 3rd gear from scratch.I think that's pretty impressive.I was hoping your bike was red on red like mine but I see you have the green on green.I could be very interested in a lot of your stuff .I have discovered that my steering head bearings are also in need of replacing and I need a right hand rear shock.mine wont hold air.So we can do some business for sure.I just bought my bike back for the second time.It was written off by my insurance company after I was T-boned by a drunk in Nov of 2006.I saw it for sale on Kijiji and decided to by it back.So now I'm trying to get it looking and running like it was when I was the previous owner if it.The two clowns that owned it over the last 10 1/2 years did not really know how to properly care for a nice machine.I will be talking to you again ,thanks Nomad Dad (Henry)

Have you tried fitting a new valve in that shock.It cured mine.
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