Ivan's reflash premium fuel

[terryd]

Originally Posted by tonik

You are taking our 'better' answer out of context. With Ivan's flash the bike has been leaned out, and the timing has been advanced. As you say higher octane is more resistant to ping. Without the higher octane Ivan's flash will most certainly ping. So in the context of the question yea, higher octane with ethanol is better than 87 without.

I believe the fuel to air ratio has been enriched, not leaned out. The bike comes from the factory too lean.

[smokier]

Originally Posted by terryd

I believe the fuel to air ratio has been enriched, not leaned out. The bike comes from the factory too lean.

I agree with what you believe... :)

[tonik]

I'm gonna stick with my original answer based on a few things.

1) With the flash it pings unless you run premium. That means one or both of two things happened. He advanced the timing or it is running leaner.
2) We are all getting the same or a bit better mpg's.
3) Ivan said to me on the phone 'this bike really likes to run lean, it is much better when leaned out'.

[captj3]

Originally Posted by tonik

I'm gonna stick with my original answer based on a few things.

1) With the flash it pings unless you run premium. That means one or both of two things happened. He advanced the timing or it is running leaner.
2) We are all getting the same or a bit better mpg's.
3) Ivan said to me on the phone 'this bike really likes to run lean, it is much better when leaned out'.

He didn't necessarily lean it out. He added timing and fuel on the low end. What makes the bike ping with regular gas is he changed how much the throttle opens from the 60%-100% range. It now opens to 100% in stead of 80%. So more air in equals more fuel and octane needed to stop the motor from pinging.

[tigertom]

love my reflash......but have a hard time finding any fuel 91 or 93 that the bike doesn't ping on at around 3000 rpm and around half throttle. anyone else?

[ToddM]

Originally Posted by rick6375

It bothers me that so many consider a higher octane as better, when its not a higher quality, but is more resistant to uncontrolled ignition, that pinging you get when you run too low of an octane for your particular set up. Ignition timing, compression ratio, combustion chamber design all play a part in the octane required, but the quality of the gas is basically all the same, and pure gas is always a better choice where available, but this is all just my opinion.

+1 A lot of people have this misconception and the fuel supply industry does nothing about educating the public for obvious reasons.

Many people also incorrectly use the word "pinging" and pre-ignition interchangeably. Pinging is the sound you hear when the remaining fuel/air mixture (after the normal combustion burn) spontaneously ignites. This is called detonation. While both pre-ignition and detonation is the spontaneous ignition of fuel, pre-ignition is before the piston is at TDC and detonation is after TDC. Octane rating is the fuel's ability to resist detonation. Detonation can be damaging depending on many factors but pre-ignition will quickly ruin an engine.

[BobBear]

Just throwing my 2 cents from my own experience with my 2015 Vaquero. I have kept my bike stock as far as engine/performance modifications. No Ivans, no aftermarket pipes, no fuel processor. Bone stock and I like it that way. I have experimented with different fuel grades and blends. Without a doubt, the 90 octane ethanol free fuel burns quite nicely at all speeds. If I put 93 octane premium in it, there is a noticeable drop in behavior from the engine. Higher octane is definitely not always better.

[terryd]

Originally Posted by tigertom

love my reflash......but have a hard time finding any fuel 91 or 93 that the bike doesn't ping on at around 3000 rpm and around half throttle. anyone else?

Did you by any chance put a BAK on at the same time that you had the reflash done?

[Lumberjack]

He advanced timing. He offered to retard timing as mine pings opening up throttle.

Originally Posted by tonik

I'm gonna stick with my original answer based on a few things.

1) With the flash it pings unless you run premium. That means one or both of two things happened. He advanced the timing or it is running leaner.
2) We are all getting the same or a bit better mpg's.
3) Ivan said to me on the phone 'this bike really likes to run lean, it is much better when leaned out'.

[tigertom]

Originally Posted by terryd

Did you by any chance put a BAK on at the same time that you had the reflash done?

no bak,has v&h slipons. rode the bike to Ivan and he did the flash and install

[terryd]

Originally Posted by BobBear

Just throwing my 2 cents from my own experience with my 2015 Vaquero. I have kept my bike stock as far as engine/performance modifications. No Ivans, no aftermarket pipes, no fuel processor. Bone stock and I like it that way. I have experimented with different fuel grades and blends. Without a doubt, the 90 octane ethanol free fuel burns quite nicely at all speeds. If I put 93 octane premium in it, there is a noticeable drop in behavior from the engine. Higher octane is definitely not always better.

You may like your bike stock, but I assure you you'll REALLY like it with the re-flash. The difference is so dramatic it's hard to understand why Kawasaki doesn't tune this bike like this themselves. Even with no exhaust or intake modifications the difference is dramatic. The dino graph on Ivan's Web page for the flash with stock exhaust and intake doesn't look like that much of a difference but it is. The whole manner of the bike changes for the better.

[tonik]

Originally Posted by terryd

The difference is so dramatic it's hard to understand why Kawasaki doesn't tune this bike like this themselves.

EPA or Euro regulations I would bet.

[VulcanD]

Originally Posted by tigertom

love my reflash......but have a hard time finding any fuel 91 or 93 that the bike doesn't ping on at around 3000 rpm and around half throttle. anyone else?

I get pinging in 5th and 6th if I goose it too low a speed. I've never had pinging in 1-3, and maybe had it once in 4th, again when goosing it at too low a speed. I've learned not to do that. Downshift.

[tigertom]

Originally Posted by VulcanD

I get pinging in 5th and 6th if I goose it too low a speed. I've never had pinging in 1-3, and maybe had it once in 4th, again when goosing it at too low a speed. I've learned not to do that. Downshift.

doesn't matter if I downshift, may have the cure at the end of next week

[DragonLady58]

With the Reflash, Theres a grade between reg which is 87, and Premium, which is 92....its a fuel at the 89 mark....we used to call it +.....which alot of these big VTwins absolutely love!
Now, you have to remember, our bikes a older than the fuels we're running....so when diff fuels come out, we gotta adapt accordingly....