2010 1700 Voyager fork oil recommendations

Calflan · 02-17-2016, 11:33 PM

Looking for recommendations.
Changing the front fork oil - original oil in forks, approx. 15k miles, oil is nasty dirty and VERY thin. I know Kawasaki uses 10w and many talk of 15 or 20 as a replacement. I usually ride two up with my wife and wondering, given we ride two up, would 20 be better than 15 or is 15 best handling and ride?
I am looking first for handling, second for less surging and smoother ride.
Thanks

Peg · 02-18-2016, 01:07 AM

I've changed my fork oil to 15W Belray, and it's an improvement... But not enough of an improvement by my reckoning. I did the same with the shocks, for the same result... Better, but not by much.

I'm having a set of Öhlins shocks built currently, and after they're paid for (it's an eye-watering amount that I'll need to keep secret from my passenger), I'll probably have the forks rebuilt with emulators by the same people who are doing my shocks. It's only money right?

Our roads down here are a lot rougher than yours, and OEM suspension simply can't cope with the big hits. I did the same work on my Nomad (oil change both ends), but with Progressive springs in the forks. That was better, but if I'd kept that bike I'd have liked a smoother ride from it as well.

For me it's simple. This Voyager is worth keeping in every other respect, so it's worth getting it right, where it's not quite right at the moment.

For handling, you could maybe also consider Garry's fork brace?

BigDog1294 · 02-18-2016, 08:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Calflan

many talk of 15 or 20 as a replacement.

I recently changed my Vaquero forks to 20W and for me it seems a little harsh. I'm considering going to 15W for a little softer ride.

RACNRAY · 02-18-2016, 08:56 AM

15 weight and raise the fork oil level 10mm from stock spec.

Racnray

Calflan · 02-18-2016, 09:37 AM

Thanks all, great info.
Good luck with your project Peg!
Ray, still loving that throttle, thanks a bunch.

Gypsy Dragon · 02-18-2016, 10:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RACNRAY

15 weight and raise the fork oil level 10mm from stock spec.

Racnray

What does 10mm translate to in volume?

Peg · 02-18-2016, 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gypsy Dragon

What does 10mm translate to in volume?

You won't get both sides exactly the same if you work by volume. Length is a much more accurate measurement.

I taped a piece of clear pvc tubing to the "zero end" of a steel ruler, clamped a crossbar to the steel ruler at my measurement, and then dropped that into each fork in turn. Over-fill the fork, then suck out excess oil using a large syringe to bring the level down to exactly the same in each side.

VulcanE · 02-18-2016, 03:45 PM

A good friend of mine mixes his own, he says 15w is a little too soft, and 20w a little too harsh, so he mixes the 15 and 20w together to get 17~18w oil, and that is what he likes, just make sure both weights of oil are the same brand. I have actually thought about doing this the next time I do mine.

recumbentbob · 02-18-2016, 04:03 PM

That's called Blending. I know someone that does that with motor oil.

Calflan · 02-19-2016, 12:43 AM

Put in 15. Also changed out the upper and lower steering head bearings to tapered. Had a shimmy when I lifted my hands off the handlebars for even a second or two. After changing oil and bearings, front end much more stable. Only took a short hop down the street, will do more tomorrow, but can't help but think the tapered bearings are much more stable than the roller from Kawasaki. The original bearings were still pretty lubricated, not dry and no signs of water ingress. Torquing the upper spanner bolt on the head is my only concern. Without a proper torque (no spanner wrench, a punch and hammer to spin loose and tighten), getting the proper torque is tough. I got it hand tight, then another half turn on the nut. Steering turns without any restriction or any apparent friction, moves smooth and easy, so I believe the torque I have on it is good. Have to think both of these will make a much more stable and better handling ride. The original oil was very thin and very dirty. Original bearings, as stated, lubed and in good shape, but I could see where those bearings could create some play over time, whereas the tapered would need be pretty loose to create any play.
P.S. removing the lower bearing race and seal was a sob. Had read where some put theirs in the freezer over night and it was easier, but with the close tolerance fit of that race, I don't see that making a huge difference. Getting the new bearing (tapered and seal) down on the shaft was great fun too. It seated at base OK against its' new seal, and again as stated, no restrictions of any kind when I move the steering side to side.
Thanks all for the comments.

RACNRAY · 02-19-2016, 08:36 AM

The first time I had an experience with tapered roller bearings was WAAAAAAY BACK in 1980!!!

I had my 1977 KZ1000 I had just bought with only 100 miles on it and was startin to play with it. A company outa England was making handling goodies for the KZ's, rectangular section swingarms and had a tapered steering head bearing set. Absolutely nothing was wrong with the stock bearings as it was a low mileage skoot, so when I took it for a test ride after installing the bearings I immediately noticed a handling improvement.

The 2 major aspects of tapered bearings over ball type is an increase in contact area between the rollers and races, and due to the tapered design far less deflection o any kind of side loading.

RACNRAY

**Sabre-t** · 02-20-2016, 04:29 PM

If your oil is that thin and dirty, take the forks off to change the oil. You need to turn them upside down to get all of the old oil and sludge out. The oil gets acidic over time and you want to get it all out. Pour it out, put a little clean oil in, pump it a few times and drain.

I don't know what would work best in these bikes, but my old bike, a Honda Sabre had 10W and I changed it to 15W and loved the feel. Not trying to be insulting, but... if you blend your own, mix it well and divide between the forks; don't try to measure half and half into a fork!

Like Peg said, go with depth not volume. You can do it with a ruler, or use a fork oil tool like:

http://www.motorcycle-superstore.com...oil-level-tool

These make it really easy to get both forks exactly the same.

Calflan · 02-21-2016, 10:05 AM

Thanks Sabre, I actually did take the forks off, didn't flush them, but left them hanging upside down overnight with a bucket under them, then actuated them several times before and after and hanging them. There is going to be just a bit of oil left, but really, really minimal amount after all that. I put in 15, no blend and do have and used a depth measuring tool. Finally took a decent ride yesterday and the feel was MUCH better. The shake was gone, after having replaced the bearings and the handling, at least for a bike this big, did seem much better. Would highly recommend anyone thinking about it, replace the steering link to tapered bearings and the oil to 15w. Really glad I did not go 20w, the feel of the 15 is definitely stiffer than the 10.
Regards and thanks again all, especially Ray, who has yet to ever give me bad advice!

**Sabre-t** · 02-22-2016, 10:47 PM

"left them hanging upside down overnight with a bucket under them, then actuated them several times before and after and hanging them."

That should do it.

Note to self: 15W fork oil, 10mm above stock level. Tapered steering bearings. Got it.

coach · 04-08-2016, 04:06 PM

Note to self: 15W fork oil, 10mm above stock level. Tapered steering bearings. Got it.[/QUOTE]

can you explain above stock level? what is the stock level now. i am about to install the progressive lowering drop in kit and they say "never add too much fluid resulting in a measurement less than 195 mm" so what mesurment should i be looking for? anyone?

02-17-2016, 11:33 PM	#1
Calflan Member Join Date: May 2013 Location: Heath, Tx. Posts: 85	2010 1700 Voyager fork oil recommendations Looking for recommendations. Changing the front fork oil - original oil in forks, approx. 15k miles, oil is nasty dirty and VERY thin. I know Kawasaki uses 10w and many talk of 15 or 20 as a replacement. I usually ride two up with my wife and wondering, given we ride two up, would 20 be better than 15 or is 15 best handling and ride? I am looking first for handling, second for less surging and smoother ride. Thanks __________________ *2010 Voyager* - Wrapped pipes; Ivan ECU Flash; Engine Ice; Debaffled stock exhaust; Thunder Intake; Ray's throttle mod on Kuryakan grips; Pax floorboard extensions; cutdown windshield; VStar trunk rack; iPod adapter. Former 2003 1600 Classic. Vulcan guy for life !! Login or Register to Remove Ads
	0

02-18-2016, 01:07 AM	#2
Peg Sr. Member Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: West Coast, North Island, New Zealand Posts: 1,375	I've changed my fork oil to 15W Belray, and it's an improvement... But not enough of an improvement by my reckoning. I did the same with the shocks, for the same result... Better, but not by much. I'm having a set of Öhlins shocks built currently, and after they're paid for (it's an eye-watering amount that I'll need to keep secret from my passenger), I'll probably have the forks rebuilt with emulators by the same people who are doing my shocks. It's only money right? Our roads down here are a lot rougher than yours, and OEM suspension simply can't cope with the big hits. I did the same work on my Nomad (oil change both ends), but with Progressive springs in the forks. That was better, but if I'd kept that bike I'd have liked a smoother ride from it as well. For me it's simple. This Voyager is worth keeping in every other respect, so it's worth getting it right, where it's not quite right at the moment. For handling, you could maybe also consider Garry's fork brace? __________________ Nothing screams poor workmanship like wrinkles in the duct tape '02 1500 blonde Nomad (Sold) '97 800 burgundy Classic (Sold)
	0

02-18-2016, 08:56 AM	#4
RACNRAY Sr. Member Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: SOUTH FLORIDA Posts: 1,210	15 weight and raise the fork oil level 10mm from stock spec. Racnray __________________ "TRUE HAPPINESS IS IN THE HEART, NOT IN THE OUTSIDE FIXES" WITH OVER 46 YEARS AS A MOTORCYCLE TECHNICIAN/HI-PO SHOP OWNER I AM A PURVEYOR OF FACT NOT FICTION! "WE LIVE OUR LIVES IN CHAINS NEVER KNOWING WE HAD THE KEY"
	0

02-18-2016, 09:37 AM	#5
Calflan Member Join Date: May 2013 Location: Heath, Tx. Posts: 85	Thanks all, great info. Good luck with your project Peg! Ray, still loving that throttle, thanks a bunch. __________________ *2010 Voyager* - Wrapped pipes; Ivan ECU Flash; Engine Ice; Debaffled stock exhaust; Thunder Intake; Ray's throttle mod on Kuryakan grips; Pax floorboard extensions; cutdown windshield; VStar trunk rack; iPod adapter. Former 2003 1600 Classic. Vulcan guy for life !! Login or Register to Remove Ads
	0

02-18-2016, 03:45 PM	#8
VulcanE Sr. Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Cartersville, Georgia Posts: 4,838	A good friend of mine mixes his own, he says 15w is a little too soft, and 20w a little too harsh, so he mixes the 15 and 20w together to get 17~18w oil, and that is what he likes, just make sure both weights of oil are the same brand. I have actually thought about doing this the next time I do mine. __________________ Cliff "VulcanE" Evans 2005 Blue & Silver 1600 Nomad VBA # 320 VROC # 20381
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02-18-2016, 04:03 PM	#9
recumbentbob Sr. Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Newburgh IN Posts: 3,404	That's called Blending. I know someone that does that with motor oil. __________________ VBA #01084 "A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the People to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."
	0

02-19-2016, 12:43 AM	#10
Calflan Member Join Date: May 2013 Location: Heath, Tx. Posts: 85	Put in 15. Also changed out the upper and lower steering head bearings to tapered. Had a shimmy when I lifted my hands off the handlebars for even a second or two. After changing oil and bearings, front end much more stable. Only took a short hop down the street, will do more tomorrow, but can't help but think the tapered bearings are much more stable than the roller from Kawasaki. The original bearings were still pretty lubricated, not dry and no signs of water ingress. Torquing the upper spanner bolt on the head is my only concern. Without a proper torque (no spanner wrench, a punch and hammer to spin loose and tighten), getting the proper torque is tough. I got it hand tight, then another half turn on the nut. Steering turns without any restriction or any apparent friction, moves smooth and easy, so I believe the torque I have on it is good. Have to think both of these will make a much more stable and better handling ride. The original oil was very thin and very dirty. Original bearings, as stated, lubed and in good shape, but I could see where those bearings could create some play over time, whereas the tapered would need be pretty loose to create any play. P.S. removing the lower bearing race and seal was a sob. Had read where some put theirs in the freezer over night and it was easier, but with the close tolerance fit of that race, I don't see that making a huge difference. Getting the new bearing (tapered and seal) down on the shaft was great fun too. It seated at base OK against its' new seal, and again as stated, no restrictions of any kind when I move the steering side to side. Thanks all for the comments. __________________ *2010 Voyager* - Wrapped pipes; Ivan ECU Flash; Engine Ice; Debaffled stock exhaust; Thunder Intake; Ray's throttle mod on Kuryakan grips; Pax floorboard extensions; cutdown windshield; VStar trunk rack; iPod adapter. Former 2003 1600 Classic. Vulcan guy for life !! Last edited by Calflan; 02-19-2016 at 12:50 AM.
	0

02-19-2016, 08:36 AM	#11
RACNRAY Sr. Member Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: SOUTH FLORIDA Posts: 1,210	The first time I had an experience with tapered roller bearings was WAAAAAAY BACK in 1980!!! I had my 1977 KZ1000 I had just bought with only 100 miles on it and was startin to play with it. A company outa England was making handling goodies for the KZ's, rectangular section swingarms and had a tapered steering head bearing set. Absolutely nothing was wrong with the stock bearings as it was a low mileage skoot, so when I took it for a test ride after installing the bearings I immediately noticed a handling improvement. The 2 major aspects of tapered bearings over ball type is an increase in contact area between the rollers and races, and due to the tapered design far less deflection o any kind of side loading. RACNRAY __________________ "TRUE HAPPINESS IS IN THE HEART, NOT IN THE OUTSIDE FIXES" WITH OVER 46 YEARS AS A MOTORCYCLE TECHNICIAN/HI-PO SHOP OWNER I AM A PURVEYOR OF FACT NOT FICTION! "WE LIVE OUR LIVES IN CHAINS NEVER KNOWING WE HAD THE KEY"
	0

02-20-2016, 04:29 PM	#12
Sabre-t Join Date: May 2015 Location: Marietta, GA Posts: 838	If your oil is that thin and dirty, take the forks off to change the oil. You need to turn them upside down to get all of the old oil and sludge out. The oil gets acidic over time and you want to get it all out. Pour it out, put a little clean oil in, pump it a few times and drain. I don't know what would work best in these bikes, but my old bike, a Honda Sabre had 10W and I changed it to 15W and loved the feel. Not trying to be insulting, but... if you blend your own, mix it well and divide between the forks; don't try to measure half and half into a fork! Like Peg said, go with depth not volume. You can do it with a ruler, or use a fork oil tool like: http://www.motorcycle-superstore.com...oil-level-tool These make it really easy to get both forks exactly the same.
	0

02-21-2016, 10:05 AM	#13
Calflan Member Join Date: May 2013 Location: Heath, Tx. Posts: 85	Thanks Sabre, I actually did take the forks off, didn't flush them, but left them hanging upside down overnight with a bucket under them, then actuated them several times before and after and hanging them. There is going to be just a bit of oil left, but really, really minimal amount after all that. I put in 15, no blend and do have and used a depth measuring tool. Finally took a decent ride yesterday and the feel was MUCH better. The shake was gone, after having replaced the bearings and the handling, at least for a bike this big, did seem much better. Would highly recommend anyone thinking about it, replace the steering link to tapered bearings and the oil to 15w. Really glad I did not go 20w, the feel of the 15 is definitely stiffer than the 10. Regards and thanks again all, especially Ray, who has yet to ever give me bad advice! __________________ *2010 Voyager* - Wrapped pipes; Ivan ECU Flash; Engine Ice; Debaffled stock exhaust; Thunder Intake; Ray's throttle mod on Kuryakan grips; Pax floorboard extensions; cutdown windshield; VStar trunk rack; iPod adapter. Former 2003 1600 Classic. Vulcan guy for life !!
	0

02-22-2016, 10:47 PM	#14
Sabre-t Join Date: May 2015 Location: Marietta, GA Posts: 838	"left them hanging upside down overnight with a bucket under them, then actuated them several times before and after and hanging them." That should do it. Note to self: 15W fork oil, 10mm above stock level. Tapered steering bearings. Got it.
	0

04-08-2016, 04:06 PM	#15
coach Member Join Date: May 2015 Location: Chicago Posts: 57	Note to self: 15W fork oil, 10mm above stock level. Tapered steering bearings. Got it.[/QUOTE] can you explain above stock level? what is the stock level now. i am about to install the progressive lowering drop in kit and they say "never add too much fluid resulting in a measurement less than 195 mm" so what mesurment should i be looking for? anyone?
	0