Now she won't start at all

[kawgirl]

I try to start the bike. Dead. I put the charger on it over night and check her out this morning. She fired right up. I had the cold idle knob pulled all the way and the throttle lock on with the throttle pulled back slightly. I let her run for about 15 minutes. When I went out to cut her off, I revved the throttle pretty good a few times. The first time, lots of carbon smoke blew out as I expected. I turned her off and heard kind of a poof sound come out of the tail pipe. I figure it was gas that had built up. I tried to start her again. NOTHING. Not even a click. The lights all came on and the fuel injectors did their thing but no turnover of the engine at all. I put the charger back on for a bit to see if the battery is just done. NOTHING again. I plan to have the battery checked out or even buy a new one as I am due for one. But outside of that, any suggestions? I sure hope the ignition switch or something else hasn't gone out. Ugggghhh.

[cactusjack]

Check the battery connections and make sure they are clean and tight.

[kawgirl]

No problems there.

[trosco]

Moose pooh may have gotten into the intake? That will cause a ridh mixture and backfiring every time!

Just kidding Amy, we know the moose go's everywhere with you!

[cactusjack]

Originally Posted by kawgirl (nckawgirl)

No problems there.

Don't take offense to this, but I have to ask:

Is the kill switch in the stop position?

--or--

Clutch or sidestand interlock switches may be dirty/loose/faulty.

[Cajunrider]

Originally Posted by cactusjack

Don't take offense to this, but I have to ask:

Is the kill switch in the stop position?

--or--

Clutch or sidestand interlock switches may be dirty/loose/faulty.

Like Scott said Amy, don't take offense about the kill switch. I tried starting mine once and it was dead. I checked connections and the battery with a volt meter. All was good and then noticed my 4 year old grandson had flipped the kill switch to the off position. Over 1 hour of troubleshooting and anxiety for nothing. Was quite happy after flipping the switch to run and it started. All anxiety suddenly left me replaced by red cheeks. :-[

[blowndodge]

I won't admit that ever happened to me too? ::) ::)

Amy, check the simple things first.

Does the headlight come on when you hit the starter button? Is is very bright? brake lights and turn signals work as normal with the headlight on? If so I doubt it's the battery. Check:

Clutch switch
kickstand switch, Starting in neutral right?

Could be the starter motor.

Don't worry as these are not catastrophic repair bill issues.

If you can borrow someone's charger with big amps you can then rule out the battery. Some chargers supply enough amps on the high settings to even light a diesel engine starter motor!

[macmac]

DO NOT hit the battery with a 25+ AMP charger. The system at best makes 30 amps. pass that amp rate by too much and it will clean out the charging system completely.

Check the safetys as mentioned. Side stand, Be in Neutral, clutch IN anyway, Red Kill switch ON.

There is no reason to rev engines..

If this was a 'winter start' and you ran the engine a shorter time than it takes to get full warm, you may have flooded the engine, and at each turn of the key from off to on again flooded the engine more.

There is no reason to winter start engines. You just make water in the oil and in the exhaust.

What is the charger amp rate? Something under 2 amps I hope for long term use.

The poof was likey fuel burning off as you suspected. That shouldn't make a real problem, unless it remains a constant.

It can help techy guys if you use the term Cranking when the engine doesn't start. What you see and hear then should be explained in detail. Any clicking, or buzzing noises and where these seem to come from.

Turnover works as well.

If the start motor does not turn at all, the main lamp will not come on at all.

Again check all safety switches, and look at the wires at the clutch lever to be sure the plug is plugged in.

I have pulled these wires out just enough to stop that connection before my mistake.
I have over looked the red switch too, and even been in gear with the side stand down.

If you want sit on the bike and hold it up with the side stand also UP, be in neutral, and still pull the clutch IN, which is a good idea on a cold start anyway.

What year bike is this?

[kawgirl]

Like I said, the first start was fine. I hit the kill switch to turn it off then flipped it back on and hit the start button. Absolutely nothing. Not even a click. The normal lights on the speedo came on and I can hear the fuel injectors but then nothing when I try to start it. No noise, nothing.

The charger I have can be set at different amperages. I didn't set it at any particular setting, just plugged it in and let it charge. It's supposed to go to a trickle charge once it's full. I will mess with it again tomorrow. Maybe.

I'll keep you posted.

[kudzufarmer]

just a thought...check the plug in connection under the clutch....I had mine come loose and the bike would not sart except in neutral...unplug it and plug it back in.

[blowndodge]

Service Manual states: 3 phase AC Twin rotor Max output of 42amps X 14 volts.

Can you explain how a 25 amp charger is going to clean out the charging system? I have pencil at the ready!

My battery is 12 volts 20 amps. I doubt a 25amp anything at only 12 volts is going to clean out the charging system.

I also put a 850 CCA (12 volts) in my car that took a stock 600 and there is no issue. Amps shouldn't blow the system as long as its 12 volts.

[trosco]

Hey, just a quick comment here. When we talk about electrical system capacities a couple terms that are not interchangable are used as if they are. Someone else can probably explaing this better but: AMPS, AMPERAGE and AMPERS which is a contraction of AMP HOURS are not the same thing! AMPS is a pure measure of current, AMPERAGE is a statement of current capability based on a specific voltage and demonstrated over a specific resistance. And AMP HOURS is a statment of capacity overtime.
A 880 CCA (cold cranking amp hours) battery does not supply 880 AMPS to any auto's circuits even momentarity. And a 25 AMPERAGE charger supplies dramatically less than that ratting because it is doing it's work accross the much higher internal resistance of a battery.
Amy, Carry the batttery to a local sears or auto parts store and have it load tested then recharge off bike if good or replace if bad. After that instal old or new battery. If problem is not then fixed then tell us does the stater motor do anything when you push the button?

[Todd]

Amy, pull that cleaner off the right side and make sure all is clear behind it too.

[macmac]

BD, No that isn't correct... Really man, no joke.. Not tryin to put you down either.

A 20 AH battery is not going to deal with 25 amps well, and it will over load that battery. The charging system spec is over rated, they all are. There is no way that alt set up is really going to put out any 42 apms in the real world.

This is a habitiual habit with in the electrical industry. I have a 8 houes power air compressor and I have my doubts it makes 6 ponies.

CCA is another thing that 850 cca is fine as a battery even it replaced a measely 600 cca. What is more omportant in that case is you don't use a charger over what ever the amp rate is on the alt in that cage... That could be hard to do.

So far as I know most battery chagers stop around 50 amps, and most cages have a bigger alt than that these days.

One example I have on hand is the Bob Cat.. it has a cca of 1,000+ something, but the alt is only 15 amps.

I can't run much of anything off that alternator, and I sure had better not be setting the charger over 10 amps for it.

If I did I would fry the diode bridge.

It is pretty common to fry the rec/reg on bikes when people use a RUNNING car/truck to jump from.

Since the car/truck alt is going to put out a high on demand from a dead battery on siad bike, there is a big chance to over load the rec/reg, and fry it.

Doing the same thing, with just the car/truck turned off, is perfectly acceptable. The said bike then will draw from the car/truck battery only as it wants and that won't fry anything.

Another way to get a jump if say you left passing lamps ON for 4 hiurs liike I did once, is to make sure the Nomad key is in yer pocket. And in the case of 05 up the ing switch is OFF.

Then you can use a running car to the bike's battery for a quick charge, but not the actual jump.

You MUST turn the car engine off, and then still with cables on, you may start the Nomad. In that case the battery is down for leaving a 10 amp draw for 4 hours. This battery then would recover completely with no damage at all.

The load of 10 amps in a 20 AH battery is twice more than the battery can run.

AH is Amp hours. You know this, but maybe not everyone does.

So a 20 Ah battery in theory only in the real world will run 1 amp 20 hours, or 20 amps 1 hour.

I do not know the formula to convert cca to ah.

[macmac]

kawgirl, You did a good job of the telling.. I was trying to just make sure.

If everything checks out, I have heard of the red switch itself going south before.

As I understand it now, the key is ON , and so far as you know all the safeties are set to be for the engine to start.

The red switch is too, and at the press of the start button, you do not get a click. The start motor does nothing.

The safety at the clutch lever is visable, so make sure the 2 prong plug there is plugged in.
The side stand safety is visable if you get down on the ground and lay there looking up.
make sure it is plugged in.

The neutral switch is buried under the left side engine cover, and not something so easy to get at, but if the green light comes on it should be working.

To by-pass any of these you would pull the connectors off and stick a paper clip in the connectors... IF you try that be CERTAIN the bike is in neutral and by rolling it with the clutch lever OUT.

If you have the book see page 16-19 at the top left is a small diagram 'Right Handel Bar Switches" (it took me 10 minutes to find it) IF this is 05 and up bike)

I have no idea where the connector is located. So if you have a ice pick test light or a ohm meter the way I would do this on line is to have you open the switch housing to test the red switch.

2 ways to test. Either dc volts or in ohms.