Observations – Radial Tires Dunlop Elite 4 – Avon Cobra AV71

**smokier** · 09-09-2017, 07:56 AM

Greetings All,

We just finished our Route 66 trip, putting just over 5000 miles on our rides in two weeks. We returned via Utah and Colorado to add some mountain roads and elevation changes. The bride was trailer free and started the trip with 7000 miles on a pair of Michelin Commander II. She now has 12k on the Michelin’s and they still look great.

I had read that the rolling resistance of Radial tires was less than Bias tires. In my mind that translated to likely better MPG’s. Since I was pulling a trailer with camping gear and clothes, figured all the MPG help I could get would be nice. The only front Radial found in the right size and load rating was the Avon Cobra AV71. The rear tire is the new Dunlop Elite 4 in radial, again in an appropriate size and load rating.

The Elite 4 is noisy on some surfaces. It howls a little on asphalt and tar patches for the first few thousand miles. This has gotten less noticeable as time and miles have past. The combination of a radial tire and a weighted trailer was not a good one. I believe this is due to the ‘softer sidewall’ profile of a radial tire. Adding the weight of the trailer and you get a washy/sloppy sensation in corners (on ramps, curves, etc.). This sensation took a little getting used to, without the trailer that sensation does not seem to be as pronounced. I WILL NOT do radials again. Since we trailer several times a season, there would be no way to avoid the washiness. As for the MPG’s benefit, there was none that I could see. We did ride serval roads out west without the trailer, the mileage seemed about the same.
The Elite 4 with 5k on it is starting to show the flat center section. This may be due to the trailer being on there for the majority of the 5k miles. Or, the longevity isn’t going to be like the Commander II’s. I suspect that I will get 12~14K out of the Elite 4. The Avon Cobra looks very good for wear. Both tires handled curves, wet pavement, etc. very well. The Avon is a quiet tire, and felt responsive when diving into corners.

The Michelin Commander II’s on the bride’s ride, still look great. If I didn’t KNOW better, I would think they had fewer miles than the Cobra and Elite 4, yet they have 7k additional miles. I *may* switch to BIAS versions of the Elite 4 and give them a run, with less trailer time. However, the noisiness and perceived wear will probably keep me in the Michelin house for a while longer.

Just some thoughts on Radials, and the Dunlop Elite 4. Your mileage, like opinions, may vary; hope the above was useful.

Ride safe,
Smokier

**Top Cat** · 09-09-2017, 10:28 AM

Nice write up. Very informative, Thanks

**Iamriding** · 09-09-2017, 01:04 PM

Thanks for sharing. I have been extremely happy with my bias Avon Cobras. I would even go so far as to say I have a biased opinion on the matter...

mbarr10 · 09-09-2017, 01:07 PM

Quote:

Just some thoughts on Radials, and the Dunlop Elite 4. Your mileage, like opinions, may vary; hope the above was useful.

Very helpful and useful. Thank you for the detailed information.

**canuckrider** · 09-11-2017, 05:55 PM

So generally speaking, what is the benefit of radial tires on a motorcycle? Better ride, cornering, handling or fuel economy? Is there really a noticeably difference?

I think back to my early 20's when I first put a set of Pirelli radials on my car and the improvement was night and day. You could not have persuaded me to go back to bias ply tires. But is there much difference with motorcycle tires between bias and radials?

**smokier** · 09-13-2017, 06:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by canuckrider

So generally speaking, what is the benefit of radial tires on a motorcycle? Better ride, cornering, handling or fuel economy? Is there really a noticeably difference?

I think back to my early 20's when I first put a set of Pirelli radials on my car and the improvement was night and day. You could not have persuaded me to go back to bias ply tires. But is there much difference with motorcycle tires between bias and radials?

IM(H)O, the ride is 'softer' on the radials. They do hide some of the smaller bumps and cracks felt by the tush. So from a "comfort" perspective, they get better marks. From a FEEL the ROAD and HANDLING perspective, they get lower (than BIAS) marks. I believe "We" are accustomed to the BIAS ply feedback. With radials, some of that feedback is gone. I am sure 'we' could get used to the feedback provided by the radials...

I saw no improvement in MPG's, so no benefit there.

Did that help? Did I answer your question?

Ride safe,
Smokier
(TO steal another's PUN, I am BIASed...)

mike07nad · 09-14-2017, 04:55 AM

Now the next question will be - Did you get more MILES on the Radial? So If you are up to it - Go put a quick 15,000 miles on your bike and let us know how it lasts.

Side note - I'm gonna assume that DBQ is Dubuque. Last week in September I will be making a pilgrimage to the tropical paradise of Boscobel, Wisconsin. Where we will be spending our days riding the highways and byways, eating at local haunts and telling stories in motel parking lots. It is a ride associated with the Borderline Cruisers (Windy City Vroc). Or at least I think it is. If you have any interest in adding miles to that tire let me know. https://www.facebook.com/groups/borderlinecruisers/

**smokier** · 09-14-2017, 12:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mike07nad

Now the next question will be - Did you get more MILES on the Radial? So If you are up to it - Go put a quick 15,000 miles on your bike and let us know how it lasts.

Side note - I'm gonna assume that DBQ is Dubuque. Last week in September I will be making a pilgrimage to the tropical paradise of Boscobel, Wisconsin. Where we will be spending our days riding the highways and byways, eating at local haunts and telling stories in motel parking lots. It is a ride associated with the Borderline Cruisers (Windy City Vroc). Or at least I think it is. If you have any interest in adding miles to that tire let me know. https://www.facebook.com/groups/borderlinecruisers/

Yes, DBQ is Dubuque, IA Love the roads around Boscobel. Would love to meet up with you and your.bride again. I don't do FB, so keep me posted. Would be glad to ride up and hang out...

I am not sure about the mile benefit of the radial. Dragging a 600lb trailer for most of the first 5k may have worn the tire.more than normal riding. At this point it looks like.less than a MC ii.

mike07nad · 09-14-2017, 07:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smokier

Yes, DBQ is Dubuque, IA Love the roads around Boscobel. Would love to meet up with you and your.bride again. I don't do FB, so keep me posted. Would be glad to ride up and hang out...

I am not sure about the mile benefit of the radial. Dragging a 600lb trailer for most of the first 5k may have worn the tire.more than normal riding. At this point it looks like.less than a MC ii.

Have we met and ridden together before?

Info for the Bosco Ride.
Hi all

The Fall ride (IWWTFTRG) is just around the corner Thursday September 28th thur Sunday October 1st so if you are coming for a day or the whole time if you want to stay at the River Inn ( now called the AmericInn) you should call real soon since they only have 9 rooms left and they are taking them off the block today but if you call and mention the fall run or my name (Rudy Bella )And they will give the block rate of $94.99 a night ,,this includes the new breakfast they have now . There phone number is
608-375-8000.
Have a good day and hope to see you all there .

Rudog

**smokier** · 09-15-2017, 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mike07nad

Have we met and ridden together before?

Greetings Mike,

:) We have met before. The most recent was two years ago at Eureka Springs.

I was riding the Green Vaquero at the time, and my bride was on the Burgundy and Cream V* 1100.

Before that, I believe we were both at the Delphi Forums Vulcan Boscobel ride. Jim Mc (Duck) organized the one I am thinking of. I think you were there... <?> Most people stayed at the Sands that time... This was the year before the IWWTFRG rides started... :)

Ride safe,
Smokier

mike07nad · 09-15-2017, 03:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smokier

Greetings Mike,

:) We have met before. The most recent was two years ago at Eureka Springs.

I was riding the Green Vaquero at the time, and my bride was on the Burgundy and Cream V* 1100.

Before that, I believe we were both at the Delphi Forums Vulcan Boscobel ride. Jim Mc (Duck) organized the one I am thinking of. I think you were there... <?> Most people stayed at the Sands that time... This was the year before the IWWTFRG rides started... :)

Ride safe,
Smokier

I forgot who Duck was once. But I remembered when I stopped and picked him up along side the road. FYI - Sands, Ah the memories -
Yea - I remember the Delphi Forum - I think I'm a moderator over there!

mbarr10 · 09-16-2017, 01:28 AM

Is this an Invite only ride?
It is not listed on the Boscobel city web site. Just thinking of taking the WI 35 road down from Minneapolis. It is very beautiful from Prescott to Wabasha and I have not rode it further south. But that section is like Spearfish Canyon almost, In places.

**smokier** · 09-16-2017, 09:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mbarr10

Is this an Invite only ride?
It is not listed on the Boscobel city web site. Just thinking of taking the WI 35 road down from Minneapolis. It is very beautiful from Prescott to Wabasha and I have not rode it further south. But that section is like Spearfish Canyon almost, In places.

MBarr, it is an OPEN invite. All are welcomed...
Momma tells me we have a Wedding to attend Saturday, so I *may* make Friday...

Ride safe,
Smokier

mike07nad · 09-16-2017, 09:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mbarr10

Is this an Invite only ride?

I invite you - There. I don't think anyone there will kick us out. If they do, You, I and my wife can go for a ride. GPS will take us back to the Motel.

I will say - I'm not really sure if there is a plan for rides. (If I find it I'll post it right here) but I kinda just get up, eat breakfast and head out with the crew to ride.

mike07nad · 09-16-2017, 09:15 AM

I knew I saw it somewhere.
It's time to start planning to attend the Boscobel, WI Fall Run (IWWTFTRG) This year it will start on Thursday September 28th and end Sunday Morning Oct. 1st come for the whole time or for the days you can make it there. I have a block of rooms in my name ( Rudy Bella) at the River Inn in Boscobel so get your rooms early.
Thursday we will meet at the River Inn and we will find a place for supper

On Friday and Saturday we will have breakfast then meet back at the motel . Kick stands up between 9:30 and 10: am and we will go explore the great roads of the area,along with finding some good places to enjoy some food and talk .

On Sunday we will head back to our homes .

09-09-2017, 07:56 AM	#1
smokier Join Date: May 2015 Location: DBQ Iowa Posts: 1,807	Observations – Radial Tires Dunlop Elite 4 – Avon Cobra AV71 Greetings All, We just finished our Route 66 trip, putting just over 5000 miles on our rides in two weeks. We returned via Utah and Colorado to add some mountain roads and elevation changes. The bride was trailer free and started the trip with 7000 miles on a pair of Michelin Commander II. She now has 12k on the Michelin’s and they still look great. I had read that the rolling resistance of Radial tires was less than Bias tires. In my mind that translated to likely better MPG’s. Since I was pulling a trailer with camping gear and clothes, figured all the MPG help I could get would be nice. The only front Radial found in the right size and load rating was the Avon Cobra AV71. The rear tire is the new Dunlop Elite 4 in radial, again in an appropriate size and load rating. The Elite 4 is noisy on some surfaces. It howls a little on asphalt and tar patches for the first few thousand miles. This has gotten less noticeable as time and miles have past. The combination of a radial tire and a weighted trailer was not a good one. I believe this is due to the ‘softer sidewall’ profile of a radial tire. Adding the weight of the trailer and you get a washy/sloppy sensation in corners (on ramps, curves, etc.). This sensation took a little getting used to, without the trailer that sensation does not seem to be as pronounced. I WILL NOT do radials again. Since we trailer several times a season, there would be no way to avoid the washiness. As for the MPG’s benefit, there was none that I could see. We did ride serval roads out west without the trailer, the mileage seemed about the same. The Elite 4 with 5k on it is starting to show the flat center section. This may be due to the trailer being on there for the majority of the 5k miles. Or, the longevity isn’t going to be like the Commander II’s. I suspect that I will get 12~14K out of the Elite 4. The Avon Cobra looks very good for wear. Both tires handled curves, wet pavement, etc. very well. The Avon is a quiet tire, and felt responsive when diving into corners. The Michelin Commander II’s on the bride’s ride, still look great. If I didn’t KNOW better, I would think they had fewer miles than the Cobra and Elite 4, yet they have 7k additional miles. I may switch to BIAS versions of the Elite 4 and give them a run, with less trailer time. However, the noisiness and perceived wear will probably keep me in the Michelin house for a while longer. Just some thoughts on Radials, and the Dunlop Elite 4. Your mileage, like opinions, may vary; hope the above was useful. Ride safe, Smokier __________________ You only get one, so "Make it the best day ever!" 2014 Victory Cross County Tour Blue Fire Gloss (BFG) "Cruella" Brides Ride: 2012 Victory Crossroads in Sunset Red "Ruby" Previous Vulcans: '15 Vaquero, '12 Vaquero, '10 1700 Nomad, '04 1500 Classic, '01 1500 Classic, '88 Vulcan 750 VROC # 10967 \| VBA # 3115 Login or Register to Remove Ads
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09-09-2017, 10:28 AM	#2
Top Cat Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Peoples Republic of New York State Posts: 15,154	Nice write up. Very informative, Thanks __________________ Tim "TC" Conley VBA #9 2011 Victory Kingpin mine 2013 Victory Boardwalk -hers [LEFT][COLOR=#000000] [SIZE=4]
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09-09-2017, 01:04 PM	#3
Iamriding Join Date: Dec 2014 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 305	Thanks for sharing. I have been extremely happy with my bias Avon Cobras. I would even go so far as to say I have a biased opinion on the matter... __________________ 2003 Nomad 1500 Memphis Shades batwing fairing \| Chuckster dual plate BAK \| Dobeck EJK \| Mustang seat \| Victory Boardwalk handlebars \| Garry's fork brace with modified KLR fork boots
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09-11-2017, 05:55 PM	#5
canuckrider Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Okotoks, AB, Canada Posts: 1,088	So generally speaking, what is the benefit of radial tires on a motorcycle? Better ride, cornering, handling or fuel economy? Is there really a noticeably difference? I think back to my early 20's when I first put a set of Pirelli radials on my car and the improvement was night and day. You could not have persuaded me to go back to bias ply tires. But is there much difference with motorcycle tires between bias and radials? __________________ "Sun on my face, wind in my hair, sound of my bike in my ears and peace in my soul..." VBA Member #01514 2008 "Ultra" Nomad 1600, Candy Plasma Blue Login or Register to Remove Ads
	0

09-16-2017, 01:28 AM	#12
mbarr10 Sr. Member Join Date: Oct 2016 Location: Minneapolis Posts: 1,562	Boscobel,WI Is this an Invite only ride? It is not listed on the Boscobel city web site. Just thinking of taking the WI 35 road down from Minneapolis. It is very beautiful from Prescott to Wabasha and I have not rode it further south. But that section is like Spearfish Canyon almost, In places. __________________ Please post back after you have solved any issues 2016 1700 Vaquero 10/4/2016 2007 1500 Classic W/ Reckless Fairing, 42,000 miles 2004 600 Honda Shadow 18,000 miles 1989 500 Honda CX Custom 55,000 miles 1973 400 Kawi Triple 5,000 miles
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09-14-2017, 04:55 AM	#7
mike07nad Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Palmyra, Pa - Near Hershey Posts: 426	Now the next question will be - Did you get more MILES on the Radial? So If you are up to it - Go put a quick 15,000 miles on your bike and let us know how it lasts. Side note - I'm gonna assume that DBQ is Dubuque. Last week in September I will be making a pilgrimage to the tropical paradise of Boscobel, Wisconsin. Where we will be spending our days riding the highways and byways, eating at local haunts and telling stories in motel parking lots. It is a ride associated with the Borderline Cruisers (Windy City Vroc). Or at least I think it is. If you have any interest in adding miles to that tire let me know. https://www.facebook.com/groups/borderlinecruisers/
	0

09-16-2017, 09:15 AM	#15
mike07nad Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Palmyra, Pa - Near Hershey Posts: 426	I knew I saw it somewhere. It's time to start planning to attend the Boscobel, WI Fall Run (IWWTFTRG) This year it will start on Thursday September 28th and end Sunday Morning Oct. 1st come for the whole time or for the days you can make it there. I have a block of rooms in my name ( Rudy Bella) at the River Inn in Boscobel so get your rooms early. Thursday we will meet at the River Inn and we will find a place for supper On Friday and Saturday we will have breakfast then meet back at the motel . Kick stands up between 9:30 and 10: am and we will go explore the great roads of the area,along with finding some good places to enjoy some food and talk . On Sunday we will head back to our homes .
	0