Is there a point where you've practiced enough?

[dantama]

I found this on the Net today and found it interesting. It tells why Motor officers die.

According to the Law Enforcement Memorial Police, Motorcycle accidents are the third leading cause of death for Police Officers. However, according to a study on PMO:

1) Improper Braking 33.6%
2) Failure to take Evasive Action 26.7%
3) Curve Negotiation 12.8%

In these accidents, 49.2% reported rider error was present. This is why accident avoidance exercises in conjunction with in-service training is of vital importance for overall safety.

It surprised me that with all their skill and practice, they still get it wrong and die due to rider error a lot.

What do you think?

[Top Cat]

It would occure to me they might be thinking only of apprehending the subject and have a lapse in judgment. It's not like in a patrol car where they can get away with more error.
Just my opinion.

[dantama]

As the article stated, "This is why accident avoidance exercises in conjunction with in-service training is of vital importance for overall safety."

I would have thought that as much practice, and testing that motor officers go through, they would have it down. But they still get killed over things like improper braking etc.

Perhaps there isn't such a thing as ENOUGH practice.

[flightdoc]

There's NEVER enough practice. Think about, unless you consiously practice on a regular basis, what are you normally doing??? Riding straight and level. You are bound to lose the edge and your skills diminish. Doesn't take long. I doubt motor cops practice all the time. They have work to do.
Practice Practice practice.......and take riding safety courses all you can. It's good for your skills and it's fun.

Nope, you can never practice enough. To say other wise would be to say you are perfect. But even a perfect person could still have an unpreventable accident. According to that statistic, 50% of the time NO rider error was present.

Don't let that discourage you from riding, you only live once so you may as well do something you enjoy.

Every time I ride I'm practicing. I'm also taking an adavanced riders course next weekend.

[misunderstood]

Never enough practice. Also can't rule out overconfidence being a cause as they know they're skilled and may push it at times.

true

I would also imagine a majority of their accidents are during high speed chases.Most likely most patrol car accidents are in high speed chases as well. They can practice slow speed maneuvers and u turns. But can they really practice unexpectdly running into sand on the road way at high speed, or a car running a red light during a chase,or even perhaps a rail crossing that is a bit rough. As we all know an emergency stop from 20-30 mph is a lot different than say 60-70 mph. As a matter of fact, how many of us have ever tried to see just how quickly we can stop from 70 mph with no regard to our brakes or tires.I certainly have not and I'm not sure what would happen if I had to.

[dantama]

According to that statistic, 50% of the time NO rider error was present.



Every time I ride I'm practicing. I'm also taking an advanced riders course next weekend.

Wolfman, I hadn't thought about it that way. That would infer that 1/2 are being killed for any other reason, shot etc, but not dying from making a rider error.

[dantama]

I would also imagine a majority of their accidents are during high speed chases.Most likely most patrol car accidents are in high speed chases as well. They can practice slow speed maneuvers and u turns. But can they really practice unexpectdly running into sand on the road way at high speed, or a car running a red light during a chase,or even perhaps a rail crossing that is a bit rough. As we all know an emergency stop from 20-30 mph is a lot different than say 60-70 mph.


As a matter of fact, how many of us have ever tried to see just how quickly we can stop from 70 mph with no regard to our brakes or tires.I certainly have not and I'm not sure what would happen if I had to.

Good explanation about not being able to practice some situations.

I have practiced high speed stops, but not nearly enough.

In another thread I discussed a way I found to try to practice in a way that will mildly surprise you, to try to replicate stopping unexpectedly (minus the adrenaline).

On a highway with hardly any other traffic ( The highway through the Uintas Wolfman) and at a time of day when only some trees had shadow across the road, I decide to pretend that I needed to make a full emergency stop when I saw a shadow that happened to touch one of the painted broken lines in the center of the road (not many did).

So rather than a parking lot practice session where you totally know when you are going to do it, 123 go type, I never knew when a shadow would touch, but when it did, bam, I hit the brakes. After a while, I only did it on down hill sections so that it was easier to get back up to speed after.

Don't do it too much, the brakes get hot, and even the tires get hot. I heated my front tire to the point that when I pulled to the side of the road, the small bits of sand and rock stuck to the tire. That was probably too much.

[flightdoc]

Wolfman,

let us know how you felt about the course. The majority of criticisms I ever recieved was "I wish it were longer" and "I wish we could actually ride on the open road as part of the experienced course"
Have fun.

As far as meanstreaks' coments about what the motor cops practice, I saw a video once of a motor cop school and they had to ride at a high speed, maybe 40-50 mph, right through some standing muddy water that was probably 6-8 inches deep. Almost every one of them dumped the bike the first time through. Later in the video the motor cops were practicing high speed pursuits of cars. Very fast and very curvy. On some of the straightaways I'd guess they where hitting 70-80 mph and all the shoulders were soft sand. If I can find the link, I'll post it for all to see.

vin

[flightdoc]

I found the video. Poor quality but interesting. I guess the high speed pursuits must be a different video. I'll find it and post it too.

vin

http://www.ccso.charlestoncounty.org:80/Motor%20Movie_Web%20Broadcast.wmv

I'll let you know about the course next weekend. I'm feeling good about it so far. They said they limit the class size to 8 riders and it runs from 8am to 5pm. I took the basic course through MSF. This experienced course will be through a harley davidson dealer which uses MSF curriculem. Looking forward to it.

[Dave]

"This experienced course will be through a harley davidson dealer"

High speed stops while passing a bar?


Sorry, I just had to be a smart $#^

[flightdoc]

I think Harley calls their program the Edge program. It is based on the MSF curriculum. You'll most likely be doing some very similar things as the Basic but more advanced. The "box" in the basic is twenty feet. The advanced is 24 feet. If you enjoyed the basic you'll enjoy the advanced.

vin