2013 Kawi 1700 Nomad starting issues

Tim Earl · 03-30-2022, 03:09 PM

2013 Kawi 1700 Nomad with 20,000 miles. It has a Cobra fi2000 module, Vance & Hines exhaust, and Kawi light bar has issues starting. I have a Bikemaster TruGel MG20Ch-BS battery that is less than two years old. When left on trickle charge, voltage reads 12.97. It will crank and run and the battery voltage holds at 14.8. The issue comes when the ignition is turned off and try to restart the bike. On second attempt, the voltage drops, and the starter struggles to turn, but the engine will start and I have experienced a backfire at this point. When attempting to crank it again, the starter barely turns and the voltage drops to around 8 or 9. I then have to recharge the battery.
The issue began two years ago with a different battery. I stopped to gas up after riding around 100 miles and the bike would not start. That is when the Bikemaster battery was installed.
I am assuming the stator is okay since it shows 14.8 volts when running, however I could be wrong. I have checked ground wires, unhooked extras added to the bike, etc.
Any help or advice is greatly appreciated.

**vulcanscott** · 03-30-2022, 06:32 PM

battery time

redjay · 03-31-2022, 02:11 PM

Have you tried disconnecting the Cobra Fi2000 module at the battery and then trying to start the bike ? Does it do the same thing on the 2nd attempt without the Fi2000 ?

Tim Earl · 03-31-2022, 03:37 PM

I have not tried unhooking the Fl-2000. Do I need to completely disconnect it, the negative post and the main connection?

andyvh1959 · 03-31-2022, 05:16 PM

Fully charge the battery. If the voltage regulator is working properly it should about 12.5v. Then check the voltage a day later to see if the battery voltage has dropped any more than a 0.2 volts. Then a day again to see if the battery voltage has dropped below 12v. If the battery dropd below 11.5v then a parasitic draw on the system is pulling the battery voltage down faster than normal. A new battery may address the issue, for a while.

A voltmeter on the bike to show the battery at various engine speeds help to indicate voltage health. Above 2500 rpm it should read about 14.7v.
May be worth getting a small digital voltage gauge, like this from Amazon:

https://www.amazon.com/Charger-Alumi...s%2C95&sr=8-14

redjay · 03-31-2022, 07:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim Earl

I have not tried unhooking the Fl-2000. Do I need to completely disconnect it, the negative post and the main connection?

Just the connection to the battery.

andyvh1959 · 04-01-2022, 05:44 PM

I doubt disconnecting the FI-2000 from the battery would have any impact on the result. The FI-2000 has been in the bike for some time, so why would it drain the battery now? Disconnecting it likely won't tell you anything.

The OP says the bike will start with the battery freshly charged and indicates 14.8v while running. That says the voltage regulation is working, and the the alternator is producing enough voltage to run the bike and charge the battery. But on restart the voltage drop indicates the starter may be pulling too many amps, like too much internal resistance and quickly pulling the battery voltage down. What he needs to know first is what is the battery voltage DURING cranking. A good system, battery and starter, should maintain 9.6v to 10.5v even cranking for 30 seconds. You shouldn't need to crank that long, but a good system should be able to do it.

So, charge the battery fully. Then connect a voltmeter on DC, to the battery. Check the sustained voltage DURING cranking. If your voltmeter has a HOLD function use it to see what the lowest voltage drop is during cranking. If it is below 9.6v during cranking, then you may have a starter issue. If it starts, let it run a bit to again confirm the running voltage (like you said 14.8v). Then shut it off, let it sit for a few minutes, turn on the ignition again and note the battery voltage, hopefully it is still above 12v.

Then with the voltmeter on DC and HOLD (if it has it) crank the bike again. Now if the cranking voltage drops below 9.6v you definitely have an issue with the starter circuit, and hopefully not the starter. Check the basics first: good connections, check and clean all connections at the starter. Check and clean all the connections at the starter relay. Check and clean the main chassis ground connections.

Then with the battery charged back up fully, repeat the check for voltage drop during cranking. If it now shows better values during cranking you may have already solved the issues. Then shut it off and start it again, check the battery voltage, should be 12v or better. Then crank it again and check the voltage drop. If it maintains at better than 9.6v you've proved out the basics and confirmed its likely NOT the battery. Save the money for a battery cause you may need it for a replacement starter based on the next steps. If nothing else, the next steps will improve the starter system even if you don't install a new starter.

If during first cranking the voltage drops to less than 9.6v but the bike starts, it is likely internal resistance in the starter. Shut it off, check the battery voltage. After a few minutes crank it again and see if the voltage drops again. If it drops below 9.6v, shut ot off. Next step then is the starter itself. Remove it from the bike and check the repair manual for servicing the starter; like cleaning the internal contacts, checking to make sure all the internal magnets are in place and not touching the rotor, checking if any bushings/bearings are seized or restricting rotation. If anything looks bad, has come loose, excessively dirty, then you likely need to buy a new starter. If so, do a net search to see if an automotive starter for a small car is a direct fit into your 1700, that could save you big bucks versus just buying the starter from Kawasaki

On my BMW R1100 at one point it was cranking hard and long, pulling the battery down quickly. I did the checks to confirm the starter may the issue. When I removed and and took the housing off I found three magnets had let loose inside the housing where riding directly on the armature creating resistance to turning, increasing the cranking load significantly. I was able to bond the magnets back in place with JB Weld and it worked for a few years but let loose again later, so I replaced the starter and issues gone. But I researched the starter itself and found the exact same starter is used in small European cars and I got an exact fit replacement for nearly 1/2 the cost of buying a new starter from BMW.

Here's some other good info. Its not always the battery but everyone jumps to replacing the battery and don't find out WHY the battery had issues:

https://www.batterystuff.com/blog/ho...%20a%20problem.

Tim Earl · 04-01-2022, 07:14 PM

It sounds like I have my weekend planned. I'll keep you guys posted as to the results. Thanks.

03-30-2022, 03:09 PM	#1
Tim Earl Jr. Member Join Date: Sep 2016 Location: Alabama Posts: 7	2013 Kawi 1700 Nomad starting issues 2013 Kawi 1700 Nomad with 20,000 miles. It has a Cobra fi2000 module, Vance & Hines exhaust, and Kawi light bar has issues starting. I have a Bikemaster TruGel MG20Ch-BS battery that is less than two years old. When left on trickle charge, voltage reads 12.97. It will crank and run and the battery voltage holds at 14.8. The issue comes when the ignition is turned off and try to restart the bike. On second attempt, the voltage drops, and the starter struggles to turn, but the engine will start and I have experienced a backfire at this point. When attempting to crank it again, the starter barely turns and the voltage drops to around 8 or 9. I then have to recharge the battery. The issue began two years ago with a different battery. I stopped to gas up after riding around 100 miles and the bike would not start. That is when the Bikemaster battery was installed. I am assuming the stator is okay since it shows 14.8 volts when running, however I could be wrong. I have checked ground wires, unhooked extras added to the bike, etc. Any help or advice is greatly appreciated. Login or Register to Remove Ads
	0

03-31-2022, 05:16 PM	#5
andyvh1959 Advanced Member Join Date: Dec 2017 Location: Green Bay WI Posts: 755	Fully charge the battery. If the voltage regulator is working properly it should about 12.5v. Then check the voltage a day later to see if the battery voltage has dropped any more than a 0.2 volts. Then a day again to see if the battery voltage has dropped below 12v. If the battery dropd below 11.5v then a parasitic draw on the system is pulling the battery voltage down faster than normal. A new battery may address the issue, for a while. A voltmeter on the bike to show the battery at various engine speeds help to indicate voltage health. Above 2500 rpm it should read about 14.7v. May be worth getting a small digital voltage gauge, like this from Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/Charger-Alumi...s%2C95&sr=8-14 __________________ My $1200 Vulcan, to start from. Login or Register to Remove Ads
	0

04-01-2022, 05:44 PM	#7
andyvh1959 Advanced Member Join Date: Dec 2017 Location: Green Bay WI Posts: 755	I doubt disconnecting the FI-2000 from the battery would have any impact on the result. The FI-2000 has been in the bike for some time, so why would it drain the battery now? Disconnecting it likely won't tell you anything. The OP says the bike will start with the battery freshly charged and indicates 14.8v while running. That says the voltage regulation is working, and the the alternator is producing enough voltage to run the bike and charge the battery. But on restart the voltage drop indicates the starter may be pulling too many amps, like too much internal resistance and quickly pulling the battery voltage down. What he needs to know first is what is the battery voltage DURING cranking. A good system, battery and starter, should maintain 9.6v to 10.5v even cranking for 30 seconds. You shouldn't need to crank that long, but a good system should be able to do it. So, charge the battery fully. Then connect a voltmeter on DC, to the battery. Check the sustained voltage DURING cranking. If your voltmeter has a HOLD function use it to see what the lowest voltage drop is during cranking. If it is below 9.6v during cranking, then you may have a starter issue. If it starts, let it run a bit to again confirm the running voltage (like you said 14.8v). Then shut it off, let it sit for a few minutes, turn on the ignition again and note the battery voltage, hopefully it is still above 12v. Then with the voltmeter on DC and HOLD (if it has it) crank the bike again. Now if the cranking voltage drops below 9.6v you definitely have an issue with the starter circuit, and hopefully not the starter. Check the basics first: good connections, check and clean all connections at the starter. Check and clean all the connections at the starter relay. Check and clean the main chassis ground connections. Then with the battery charged back up fully, repeat the check for voltage drop during cranking. If it now shows better values during cranking you may have already solved the issues. Then shut it off and start it again, check the battery voltage, should be 12v or better. Then crank it again and check the voltage drop. If it maintains at better than 9.6v you've proved out the basics and confirmed its likely NOT the battery. Save the money for a battery cause you may need it for a replacement starter based on the next steps. If nothing else, the next steps will improve the starter system even if you don't install a new starter. If during first cranking the voltage drops to less than 9.6v but the bike starts, it is likely internal resistance in the starter. Shut it off, check the battery voltage. After a few minutes crank it again and see if the voltage drops again. If it drops below 9.6v, shut ot off. Next step then is the starter itself. Remove it from the bike and check the repair manual for servicing the starter; like cleaning the internal contacts, checking to make sure all the internal magnets are in place and not touching the rotor, checking if any bushings/bearings are seized or restricting rotation. If anything looks bad, has come loose, excessively dirty, then you likely need to buy a new starter. If so, do a net search to see if an automotive starter for a small car is a direct fit into your 1700, that could save you big bucks versus just buying the starter from Kawasaki On my BMW R1100 at one point it was cranking hard and long, pulling the battery down quickly. I did the checks to confirm the starter may the issue. When I removed and and took the housing off I found three magnets had let loose inside the housing where riding directly on the armature creating resistance to turning, increasing the cranking load significantly. I was able to bond the magnets back in place with JB Weld and it worked for a few years but let loose again later, so I replaced the starter and issues gone. But I researched the starter itself and found the exact same starter is used in small European cars and I got an exact fit replacement for nearly 1/2 the cost of buying a new starter from BMW. Here's some other good info. Its not always the battery but everyone jumps to replacing the battery and don't find out WHY the battery had issues: https://www.batterystuff.com/blog/ho...%20a%20problem. __________________ My $1200 Vulcan, to start from. Last edited by andyvh1959; 04-01-2022 at 05:54 PM.
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03-30-2022, 06:32 PM	#2
vulcanscott Join Date: Oct 2013 Location: chandler okla Posts: 854	battery time
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03-31-2022, 02:11 PM	#3
redjay Top Contributor Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Ontario Posts: 6,927	Have you tried disconnecting the Cobra Fi2000 module at the battery and then trying to start the bike ? Does it do the same thing on the 2nd attempt without the Fi2000 ?
	0

03-31-2022, 03:37 PM	#4
Tim Earl Jr. Member Join Date: Sep 2016 Location: Alabama Posts: 7	I have not tried unhooking the Fl-2000. Do I need to completely disconnect it, the negative post and the main connection?
	0

04-01-2022, 07:14 PM	#8
Tim Earl Jr. Member Join Date: Sep 2016 Location: Alabama Posts: 7	It sounds like I have my weekend planned. I'll keep you guys posted as to the results. Thanks.
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