Is it the tires or me? I am afraid of laying it down...

[aron77]

I really need some help because right now I am not riding very confidently at all, it feels like I just started riding and I've put 20k on this bike. I don't know if it is the new tires, something mechanical or just my confidence or some combination.

I replaced the stock tires on my 2011 vaquero with Commander II last year and every since I put the front tire on I just don't feel like I am riding smoothly or cornering well and my confidence has steadily gone way down. I have put 20k, maybe 3k or 4k on the new tires, on this bike and I have not worried this much about laying it down since I started riding. I rode my bike to my new job down town (down town riding sucks) for the first time a few weeks ago and I dropped it trying to pull into the parking garage. I don't know if the tires had anything to do with it but I don't feel as balanced with them at slow speeds. You have to pull in an exit to get to the bike parking and the ground is sloped and then I had a box truck behind me and I think I panicked a little trying to get up this slope in between the medians and I think I just squeezed the front brake too hard and dropped it still running with my hand on the clutch. This definitely effected me and made me afraid of losing balance and dropping it or god forbid laying it down on a lean.

I posted before about air pressure and I pumped the front up from 28 to 38 because I weigh 300 lbs and I thought that was helping but then I rode it to work today and took the long way home right through the city and I just wasn't confident as I felt all the bumps and grooves in the road and I'm not sure if it is just me or if it is riding that rough. Most of the reviews on the commanders were great but I recall a few that talked about rough riding. My next step, which I don't know how to do, is to pump up the shocks and see if that helps and maybe continue to tweak the tire pressure. But I'm almost at a point where I want to replace the front tire yet that isn't cheap... For now I am just putting around not taking any chances on leans but I think riding so cautiously is putting me more at risk of dropping it again.

[seawolf]

Aron, I have got 70000 kms on my 2013 Voyager. I put MC II's on after 12,000 kms. I found that the front steering stem bearings that Kawi put in were sh*t and replaced them with Alls bearings. Head shake disappeared and can now ride hands free. I find the ride with the MC II to be the most positive bar none. I have 32psi in the front and 40 psi rear and I'm 250+lbs plus all the gear when on long rides. Running 34 psi shocks and normal III on the adjustment. IIII when loaded up. Yes, i feel the groves and the only time i slow down and take care is snakes in the road and rain. Great tire as far as I'm concerned,

[Monkeyman]

Make sure they put the front tire on the right way. It's directional.

[Snake Ranch]

Originally Posted by aron77

I really need some help because right now I am not riding very confidently at all, it feels like I just started riding and I've put 20k on this bike. I don't know if it is the new tires, something mechanical or just my confidence or some combination.

I replaced the stock tires on my 2011 vaquero with Commander II last year and every since I put the front tire on I just don't feel like I am riding smoothly or cornering well and my confidence has steadily gone way down. I have put 20k, maybe 3k or 4k on the new tires, on this bike and I have not worried this much about laying it down since I started riding. I rode my bike to my new job down town (down town riding sucks) for the first time a few weeks ago and I dropped it trying to pull into the parking garage. I don't know if the tires had anything to do with it but I don't feel as balanced with them at slow speeds. You have to pull in an exit to get to the bike parking and the ground is sloped and then I had a box truck behind me and I think I panicked a little trying to get up this slope in between the medians and I think I just squeezed the front brake too hard and dropped it still running with my hand on the clutch. This definitely effected me and made me afraid of losing balance and dropping it or god forbid laying it down on a lean.

I posted before about air pressure and I pumped the front up from 28 to 38 because I weigh 300 lbs and I thought that was helping but then I rode it to work today and took the long way home right through the city and I just wasn't confident as I felt all the bumps and grooves in the road and I'm not sure if it is just me or if it is riding that rough. Most of the reviews on the commanders were great but I recall a few that talked about rough riding. My next step, which I don't know how to do, is to pump up the shocks and see if that helps and maybe continue to tweak the tire pressure. But I'm almost at a point where I want to replace the front tire yet that isn't cheap... For now I am just putting around not taking any chances on leans but I think riding so cautiously is putting me more at risk of dropping it again.

If you can jack the front tire off the ground and then spin it by hand. It should run straight and true.

If there is any kind of wobble the tire is going bad. Change it.

I had a little over 7000 miles on an MCII and it started to distort. At first I thought it was the steering stem bearings. After eliminating the bearings and the adjustment, I found the tire wobble from side to side. On the straight away it was smooth riding, but in a lefthand turn I could feel the feedback.

I changed the tire for another MCII and the problem went away.

I contacted Michelin headquarter's motorcycle division and explained what was going on. They had me go to a dealer of my choice to check out my complaint. I bought a new tire, Michelin prorated the wear and sent me a check for the difference.

I run 42 psi in the front.

The front suspension of the Vaquero is like no suspension at all.

I went with RaceTec .85 springs and emulators.

A lot of riders try to get their tire pressure to do the job of the suspension.

[redjay]

The Commander II's on the front of both my Voyager and then my V Star has never really felt planted in the corners. I am switching to a Metzeler 888 on the front wheel next season.

[aron77]

Thanks for the responses. I am really wondering if it is just how these tires function, particularly at my weight, since I read a lot of review before I bought them and what I am experiencing is very similar to the few negative reviews that I saw. I may try to run by the shop that installed them and see if they can check all the stuff you guys mentioned out. I was hoping that everything would smooth out once they were broken in but I've got at least 2000 miles on the front tire now and then I dropped the bike a couple of weeks ago which is really in my head now. Now I am starting to wonder if the bike is unsafe as is or just less smooth but safe and I just need to trust the lean again.

[Snake Ranch]

Originally Posted by aron77

Thanks for the responses. I am really wondering if it is just how these tires function, particularly at my weight, since I read a lot of review before I bought them and what I am experiencing is very similar to the few negative reviews that I saw. I may try to run by the shop that installed them and see if they can check all the stuff you guys mentioned out. I was hoping that everything would smooth out once they were broken in but I've got at least 2000 miles on the front tire now and then I dropped the bike a couple of weeks ago which is really in my head now. Now I am starting to wonder if the bike is unsafe as is or just less smooth but safe and I just need to trust the lean again.

When you say you dropped it, Why did you go down?

Not going fast enough for the lean angle, or did it wash out because you passed over some loose "stuff"?

My best guess is it just rides that rough. I always thought my Vaquero rode like a buckboard.

When you increased your tire pressure you are going to feel more bumps in the road.

The more air pressure, the harder the tire, the more it becomes like a wagon wheel, the better the suspension needs to be.

[rolfe]

My thoughts are to have the front stem (bearing), wheel bearings, and tire checked.
I'm running 150/80-16 front and back.
I too have had the very feelings as many of us do and they tend to compound mentally.

Not to worry though as I found it was the type of rubber compound used to make the tires. The hard rubber compound gives us the ultimate tire mileage, but at least to me I've found it just wasn't worth it.

for example:
my ME 880's lasted for unbeatable mileage but just wasn't up to snuff all around in handling.

my Dunlops the mileage was low but the grip was much better. (several sets purchased).

my Pirelli Night Dragons which I purchased after reading reviews was a big mistake and I pulled them off - they changed the handling of "RED" so dramatically is was dangerous to ride. On dry pavement it just didn't matter.

the latest tires on RED are just plain Shinko Tires - soft rubber which grips the road- and I will be lucky to get 10k out of them. But the (is it me or is it bike feeling) haunting no longer clouds my riding.

Reviews are okay but each rider is different in ALL physical aspects. I personally like a soft rubber compound tire and for sure willing to accept the high mileage loss.

Safety is the key.

[Monkeyman]

I had Dunlop E3s (DUAL compound) on my last bike ('12 Victory Vision). They handled superbly! I could (and did) scrape the floor boards more than once without a hit of slip. Very confidence inspiring. (I felt like I was on a crotch rocket, not a 900# Barcalounger.) I sold it with about 10k miles on both tires and they were still good for another few thousand, at least. If you go with the E3s make sure you get the dual compound tires. The older single compound tires wore out at about 4k miles.

[Top Cat]

You said you dropped the bike because you had the bars turned and hit the front brake. Any bike, no matter what tire you have will do that.

[smokier]

Greetings Aron77,

What goes in between our left ear and our right ear plays a HUGE part in motorcycling "comfort/confidence".

All the questions (What were you doing, how did you do it, what happened) and all the recommendations have merit worth your consideration.

Here is my (Humble) suggestion. To help you regain your confidence, in the bike, the tires and yourself. Go find a nice big parking lot. The emptier, the better. Practice figure 8's, cone weaves, turning inside a box. Slow speed maneuvers, everything you can remember for the motorcycle license test. Everything you have seen in the RIDE-LIKE-A-PRO videos, every tip. Go to a parking lot and practice. Practice, reacquaint yourself with your ride. Start off slow and simple, gradually tighten and shrink. Aim small, miss small. Re-establish that faith in your bike, your tire, your skills. Get your head right... Just my thoughts, hope it was helpful.


BTW: I believe a *little* fear is a good thing (aka Caution). When we get over confident is when we go off track. Hubris, I think is the term.

Ride safe,
Smokier

[Kopperhed]

Originally Posted by aron77

I really need some help because right now I am not riding very confidently at all, it feels like I just started riding and I've put 20k on this bike. I don't know if it is the new tires, something mechanical or just my confidence or some combination.

I replaced the stock tires on my 2011 vaquero with Commander II last year and every since I put the front tire on I just don't feel like I am riding smoothly or cornering well and my confidence has steadily gone way down. I have put 20k, maybe 3k or 4k on the new tires, on this bike and I have not worried this much about laying it down since I started riding. I rode my bike to my new job down town (down town riding sucks) for the first time a few weeks ago and I dropped it trying to pull into the parking garage. I don't know if the tires had anything to do with it but I don't feel as balanced with them at slow speeds. You have to pull in an exit to get to the bike parking and the ground is sloped and then I had a box truck behind me and I think I panicked a little trying to get up this slope in between the medians and I think I just squeezed the front brake too hard and dropped it still running with my hand on the clutch. This definitely effected me and made me afraid of losing balance and dropping it or god forbid laying it down on a lean.

I posted before about air pressure and I pumped the front up from 28 to 38 because I weigh 300 lbs and I thought that was helping but then I rode it to work today and took the long way home right through the city and I just wasn't confident as I felt all the bumps and grooves in the road and I'm not sure if it is just me or if it is riding that rough. Most of the reviews on the commanders were great but I recall a few that talked about rough riding. My next step, which I don't know how to do, is to pump up the shocks and see if that helps and maybe continue to tweak the tire pressure. But I'm almost at a point where I want to replace the front tire yet that isn't cheap... For now I am just putting around not taking any chances on leans but I think riding so cautiously is putting me more at risk of dropping it again.

you went from under-inflated to max-inflated front tire and gripe about bumps, and drop the bike in a low-speed/dry pavement turn......... I will pay for the shipping when you are ready to send me that tire.

[andyvh1959]

Put your money into riding training instead of tires and you'll get FAR more for the dollars. Take a road course specific to visual control and cornering techniques. The experience will build your confidence and help you realize what you need to do to control your bike instead of waiting to react to whatever the bike encounters.

[Top Cat]

I have Commander 2 tires front and rear on my Victory Kingpin.
They suck so bad in the rain it is dangerous. Have about 2000 miles on them, the bike is up for the winter months. Those tires are coming off first thing in the spring.


Kopprehed, you want them and pay shipping you got them.