Clutch Slipping

[mick56]

Originally Posted by Brydgy

Well I contacted Judge himself and can buy from him. I also emailed EZON and now he states my order will go out on the 15th. I ordered on the 5th!

Good result then mate.10 day's waiting to ship is a bit long,but may be down to him being a one man band,and having to make them to order.

[mick56]

Originally Posted by EdmontonNomad

A quick google search confirms that lead is a gasket material used because it is cheap/inexpensive. Lead is also soft malleable, dense, durable, long life span, generally corrosion resistant. To me seems like a quite suitable gasket material

Why did I say the clutch cover gasket was lead?

Prior to installing the clutch cover gasket, I noted that there was a crevice extending radially across the sealing surface, ie. from the inner edge to the outer edge. Considering the precautions taken in removing the remnants of the old gasket material so as not to score or scratch the aluminum, I realized this could be a leakage risk. Not having taken the gasket out of the package and believing the gasket was steel, I was not satisfied with how to install it from a web search

I went to the dealer and said I think I need another clutch cover gasket as this one is defective and what type of sealant would I use on the steel gasket.

The reply was that it went on dry and that it was lead.

Oh, the lead compresses and the small crevice or other small defects are essentially ironed out.

The gasket doesn 't leak.

I am not a metallurgist
1. I am advised that it is lead
2. it is metal
3. it is soft, malleable

to me as indicated it's lead. Of course someone can advise me otherwise.

Upon reviewing the parts picture prior to installing the exhaust pipe, I noted an exhaust pipe holder gasket, that I was sure was not present. I advised the dealer that I had it had not been installed, but was assured that it had to be there but had been crushed and had to be pried or picked out. A muffler flange gasket was also indicated that I had not observed.

I purchased both the exhaust pipe holder gasket (whether there or not it was needed) as well as the muffler flange gasket.

Yep the muffler flange gasket was there, but it was not coming out. The exhaust pipe fit snuggly and with the clamp it would be tight.

The package of the muffler flange gasket stated that it was lead and that it should be disposed of properly. There you go a lead gasket.

In my earlier post, I stated that the original gasket that I removed from my year 2000 nomad was paper. I looked at a piece of that gasket today more closely. It is not paper. I had seen that type of gasket material many years ago, I believe it could be phenolic.

Anyone got a chair,i got the beers,

[Brydgy]

Possibly mick. I'll see come Saturday. Hope he is a man of his word. Thanks again to all for your help.

[DragonLady58]

Originally Posted by mick56

Anyone got a chair,i got the beers,

Mick, I ain't gonna even try....my neck is hurting from shaking my head so much....

[MAS Tequila]

Like I said, I don't know how things are done in Canada but here in the good old USA the following materials were cut and pasted from different gasket ads.

And everyone here will take as gospel any and all quotes that someone will post from 'Gus' the dealer mechanic.

Lead had been, and is being removed from just about everything here.

Lead melts at 621 F, exhaust gasses easily reach 1200-1500 F, do the math.

Maybe that's why the last crush gaskets I bought (HD) were 6061 aluminum core with a copper exterior.

How many clutch side covers have YOU reinstalled?

I've lost count, and haven't had one problem with using a bit of silicone to hold things in place.

I hope you and 'Gus' have fun together.

MT

Knitted and compressed stainless steel wire

Includes square profile compressed-wire gaskets

Wire mesh crush style

Steel core with Fire ring armor

Fiber gasket with copper fire ring

[DragonLady58]

Originally Posted by MAS Tequila

Like I said, I don't know how things are done in Canada but here in the good old USA the following materials were cut and pasted from different gasket ads.

And everyone here will take as gospel any and all quotes that someone will post from 'Gus' the dealer mechanic.

Lead had been, and is being removed from just about everything here.

Lead melts at 621 F, exhaust gasses easily reach 1200-1500 F, do the math.

Maybe that's why the last crush gaskets I bought (HD) were 6061 aluminum core with a copper exterior.

How many clutch side covers have YOU reinstalled?

I've lost count, and haven't had one problem with using a bit of silicone to hold things in place.

I hope you and 'Gus' have fun together.

MT

Knitted and compressed stainless steel wire

Includes square profile compressed-wire gaskets

Wire mesh crush style

Steel core with Fire ring armor

Fiber gasket with copper fire ring

Plus, you bend your lead gasket sharply, it would break.....
Now The EPA and the lot will do back flips and cartwheels over lead. Not to mention your sphencter growing a new eye over the lead contamination, and toxicity....
Remember, they removed it from gasoline, and lead was a major lubricant in the full and boosted octane....
Thanks MAS....and the others, consider yourself a expert after you surpass the # of fingers on both hands, either by choice or by accident.
Yep, they don't make lead anything too much anymore. You can melt lead with your cigarette lighter! I do have a really sweet large lead hammer though I use when I really wanna frak something up.....

[Sabre-t]

Originally Posted by EdmontonNomad

A quick google search confirms that lead is a gasket material used because it is cheap/inexpensive. Lead is also soft malleable, dense, durable, long life span, generally corrosion resistant. To me seems like a quite suitable gasket material

Why did I say the clutch cover gasket was lead?

Prior to installing the clutch cover gasket, I noted that there was a crevice extending radially across the sealing surface, ie. from the inner edge to the outer edge. Considering the precautions taken in removing the remnants of the old gasket material so as not to score or scratch the aluminum, I realized this could be a leakage risk. Not having taken the gasket out of the package and believing the gasket was steel, I was not satisfied with how to install it from a web search

I went to the dealer and said I think I need another clutch cover gasket as this one is defective and what type of sealant would I use on the steel gasket.

The reply was that it went on dry and that it was lead.

Oh, the lead compresses and the small crevice or other small defects are essentially ironed out.

The gasket doesn 't leak.

I am not a metallurgist
1. I am advised that it is lead
2. it is metal
3. it is soft, malleable

to me as indicated it's lead. Of course someone can advise me otherwise.

Upon reviewing the parts picture prior to installing the exhaust pipe, I noted an exhaust pipe holder gasket, that I was sure was not present. I advised the dealer that I had it had not been installed, but was assured that it had to be there but had been crushed and had to be pried or picked out. A muffler flange gasket was also indicated that I had not observed.

I purchased both the exhaust pipe holder gasket (whether there or not it was needed) as well as the muffler flange gasket.

Yep the muffler flange gasket was there, but it was not coming out. The exhaust pipe fit snuggly and with the clamp it would be tight.

The package of the muffler flange gasket stated that it was lead and that it should be disposed of properly. There you go a lead gasket.

In my earlier post, I stated that the original gasket that I removed from my year 2000 nomad was paper. I looked at a piece of that gasket today more closely. It is not paper. I had seen that type of gasket material many years ago, I believe it could be phenolic.

Lead IS used as a gasket material. So are arsenic, beryllium, bismuth,... but NOT in internal combustion engines. Lead is used as a gasket material in some industrial electric motors and, I'm sure, in other specialty applications. As MT noted, it makes absolutely no sense for it to be used as an exhaust gasket due to melting point alone.

The dealer you talked to was blowing smoke up your a$$ or simply was making stuff up because he didn't know what he was talking about.

Just about anything to do with an engine is likely to be labeled "dispose properly" because of oil or other chemical contamination, or the presence of any number of metals other than lead.

Phenolic gaskets are used where heat transfer would be a problem, such as using a phenolic gasket to insulate a carburetor from the heat of an engine in some designs. There is no good reason to put a phenolic gasket on a clutch cover.

[EdmontonNomad]

I have attached relevant excerpts from the official Kawasaki nomad vn1500fi service manual.

The clutch hub nut is removed by an impact wrench--electric corded will do instead of an air impact wrench (no locking gear, penny etc is required) it comes off in seconds.

the clutch hub nut is installed by tightening the clutch hub nut to 108 ft lb while holding the primary gear nut.

the primary gear nut is torqued to 108 ft lb.

unless you are using an impact wrench there should be no problems with overtorquing or stripping. I experienced no problems.

Please note that the procedure for a 1600 nomad and 1700 nomad are different. On the 1600 nomad you apparently have to lock the gears.

I would suggest before commencing work you obtain the service manual. It was available from manuals4mechanics.com on cd that was keyword searchable. that is where I got mine, but I looked today and for some reason the 2000-2004 Kawasaki fi nomad series manual is no longer listed. It was a nominal $9.95 us and if ordered on ebay he would email you a copy within 1 day or sooner so you could use it right away as well as mailing you a cd. Dont know why he wouldn't still have one available.

[mick56]

Or you could just download a free copy.Kawasaki vn1500 - Free Pdf Manuals Download

[EdmontonNomad]

A selection of free manuals are available from

https://www.vulcanrider.se/en/kawasa...rvice-manuals/

including 1700 nomad, 1600 nomad, vaquero, etc. but not the 1500 nomad fi.

However, they do have the 1500 nomad 1998-99 (carbed) I believe other than carb versus fi, the bikes are basically the same, except I do note some differences, for example on the carbed the clutch hub nut is torqued to 110 ft lbs. versus fi where it is torqued to 108 ft lbs.

However, the clutch plate, spring install on my cursory, quick review seems the same, including using a wrench on the primary gear during the clutch hub nut torquing.

they appear to be waiting for someone to upload the 1500 fi service manual.

[degreaser]

he has the 2000-2008 1500 Classic Fi download, same motor in the 1500 Nomad Fi?

[DragonLady58]

Originally Posted by degreaser

he has the 2000-2008 1500 Classic Fi download, same motor in the 1500 Nomad Fi?

Yes.....same.....FYI, the 1600 is exactly the same engine as the 1500, has a touch longer stroke, 100cc's worth.
As MAS has told everyone, the way to tell the diff. between the 1500/1600s, the 1600s have the scalloped covers on top of the heads.....

[Brydgy]

Thanks for the manual link Mick. Washers are in customs at border. Going to get the cam chain extensions too. Can get at dealer here in Canada for 9 bucks CAD!

[Brydgy]

So I finally get it together and fire it up and it is making a racket inside the clutch cover. I have clutch and it will move but I don't like the noise. Going to tear it back down again yet has anyone experienced this? Thanks.

[Brydgy]

Found it. A bent washer. Nothing big anyway. Thanks.