Sounds like a stupid question

ldhthept · 10-28-2018, 06:58 PM

06 Nomad. Trying to change reg driving lights to led bulbs. Keeps blowing fuse when I turn them on. Found some discolored fittings and replaced those, lights worked. Take it for a ride and driving lights blow immmediately. Traced wire to relay under the seat, 12v 30 A 4 prong relay. Looks like I wired it to get keyed power from rear lights. Am I pulling to many amps on this relay to keep blowing the ACCESSORY 10 amp fuse in fuse box? (That’s one of the stupid questions!). Another question is how? Since I used the same circuit to run the reg driving lights for years. Can I just switch to a higher amp fuse in the fuse box? (Is that another stupid question?) Do I need to tap a different keyed power source, one with less on it? How do you test a relay? One of the tabs on the relay has a fuse on it that is not getting blown. Any help is appreciated. Thx.

recumbentbob · 10-28-2018, 07:12 PM

Do NOT replace the 10 amp fuse with a larger one.
Wire the lights like in the link below.

the lights should be wired like this
http://vulcanbagger.com/forums/showthread.php?t=15758

ldhthept · 10-28-2018, 08:36 PM

Can I just replace the 30A relay with a 40A to see if that cures the prob?

recumbentbob · 10-28-2018, 08:56 PM

You may just have a bad relay, try a new 30 amp relay. 2 driving lights don't draw near 30 amps.

**plumber63** · 10-28-2018, 10:38 PM

The leds should be pulling a lot less amps than the old lights. If you are blowing fuse as soon as you turn them on, then it sounds more like a short, not too much current draw.

Check for a pinched wire. Or remove each new bulb one at a time and see if one of them is bad.

A 10 amp fuse can handle 120 watts at 12 volts.

ldhthept · 10-29-2018, 09:32 AM

The power to the relay is coming from the tail/brake lights, no clue how much they draw since I have added LED back there as well as running/brake lights. Will have to rewire to understand what I did because the relay has a wire with a fuse in it and I don’t know why or where it goes. Thx for replies.

recumbentbob · 10-29-2018, 04:39 PM

Wire it like the drawing shows in the link I provided. Power coming from the battery, sounds like you have too much on the tail light circuit causing the fuse to blow.

**plumber63** · 10-29-2018, 07:35 PM

You say you are blowing the 10 amp fuse the driving lights are on, correct?
Not the running brake light fuse which sounds like you are using to trigger the relay to turn on the driving lights. If this is the case then it on the driving light side not the trigger side, so it is a issue with the driving lights or the wiring to them.

ldhthept · 10-29-2018, 09:07 PM

Thx! Think I will just totally rewire and make sure its all correct.

andyvh1959 · 11-01-2018, 12:01 PM

First off it sounds like a direct short and not a fuse rating issue. Also, why is it wired to the brake light circuit? That means when you blow that fuse you have no tail/brake light as well. But, why even have it wired to the brake light circuit when all Vulcans have two accessory power circuits already wired into the bike; white wire/blue line, is already separately fused, on a 10 amp fuse. On the attached wiring diagram, the accessory wires are right above the image of the headlight.

Also, just because they are LED bulbs doesn't mean low amperage draw. Some LED bulbs of high output can draw as much as conventional bulbs. I wired twin 55 watt LED spotlights into my buddies VN900 on the accessory circuit. No problems running the lights on the 10amp fuse for two years now.

**Sabre-t** · 11-01-2018, 01:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by andyvh1959

Also, just because they are LED bulbs doesn't mean low amperage draw. Some LED bulbs of high output can draw as much as conventional bulbs. I wired twin 55 watt LED spotlights into my buddies VN900 on the accessory circuit. No problems running the lights on the 10amp fuse for two years now.

Were they actually 55 watts each or produced lumens that were equated to 55 watt incandescent bulbs? LEDs that actually consumed 55 watts would either be so bright that they would be dangerous (and illegal) or so poorly engineered that they wasted most of those watts.

scooter1600 · 11-01-2018, 06:19 PM

Also, just because they are LED bulbs doesn't mean low amperage draw. Some LED bulbs of high output can draw as much as conventional bulbs. I wired twin 55 watt LED spotlights into my buddies VN900 on the accessory circuit. No problems running the lights on the 10amp fuse for two years now.[/QUOTE]

I have 2 10wt LED lights for drivers
equivalent to 110wt light output on each
power draw is 20wt.
less than a tail /brake lamp bulb.
Mark

we rely on the correct information being given here

andyvh1959 · 11-02-2018, 08:58 AM

I'll have to go back and see what the actual rating was on the LED bulbs I installed in the driving lights I installed on my buddies VN900. They are listed on Ebay as 50watt bulbs. But perhaps that is the "equivalent output" versus the actual rated wattage. When I installed the lights I checked the voltage drop at the battery at idle when I turned on the lights. I wired them with a relay to the 10 amp accessory circuit.

**Sabre-t** · 11-02-2018, 02:14 PM

You can't always trust what cheap LED bulbs list as specs, especially on ebay. I just looked at 3 bulbs with almost the exact same description and picture as in your pic. In the details, one said 25W per bulb, another said 50W per, the 3rd said 100W per bulb (even though the product description said 50W!).

The other reason I doubt the claim of 50W per bulb is that a small H3 bulb consuming 50 Watts would get ridiculously hot. Without a major heat sink or a fan, an H3 pulling 50 Watts would burn out in a few hours if not minutes.

andyvh1959 · 11-03-2018, 12:17 AM

All very good points, especially since near every LED bulb comes from somewhere in China. They can claim whatever they want with no one questioning. I was concerned when I installed the bulbs expecting to see significant voltage top across the battery when the lights came on. Yet, even at idle, the battery voltage remained 13.5 volts, and quickly bumped up to 14.7 volts when I got the revs up to three grand.

That indicates the actual wattage of the two 50 watt bulbs is likely much less that the wattage claimed. But at 50 watts per bulb, at 100 watts total, and 13.5 volts the amp draw is only 7.4 amps, well within the 10 amp fuse on the circuit. Even at 12 volts the amperage is only 8.3 amps.

10-28-2018, 06:58 PM	#1
ldhthept Sr. Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Tallahassee FL Posts: 1,035	Sounds like a stupid question 06 Nomad. Trying to change reg driving lights to led bulbs. Keeps blowing fuse when I turn them on. Found some discolored fittings and replaced those, lights worked. Take it for a ride and driving lights blow immmediately. Traced wire to relay under the seat, 12v 30 A 4 prong relay. Looks like I wired it to get keyed power from rear lights. Am I pulling to many amps on this relay to keep blowing the ACCESSORY 10 amp fuse in fuse box? (That’s one of the stupid questions!). Another question is how? Since I used the same circuit to run the reg driving lights for years. Can I just switch to a higher amp fuse in the fuse box? (Is that another stupid question?) Do I need to tap a different keyed power source, one with less on it? How do you test a relay? One of the tabs on the relay has a fuse on it that is not getting blown. Any help is appreciated. Thx. Login or Register to Remove Ads
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10-28-2018, 07:12 PM	#2
recumbentbob Sr. Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Newburgh IN Posts: 3,404	Do NOT replace the 10 amp fuse with a larger one. Wire the lights like in the link below. the lights should be wired like this http://vulcanbagger.com/forums/showthread.php?t=15758 __________________ VBA #01084 "A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the People to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."
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10-28-2018, 08:56 PM	#4
recumbentbob Sr. Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Newburgh IN Posts: 3,404	You may just have a bad relay, try a new 30 amp relay. 2 driving lights don't draw near 30 amps. __________________ VBA #01084 "A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the People to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."
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10-28-2018, 10:38 PM	#5
plumber63 Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: NE Indiana Posts: 985	The leds should be pulling a lot less amps than the old lights. If you are blowing fuse as soon as you turn them on, then it sounds more like a short, not too much current draw. Check for a pinched wire. Or remove each new bulb one at a time and see if one of them is bad. A 10 amp fuse can handle 120 watts at 12 volts. __________________ Troy Donat VBA #02401 2015 Voyager 2006 1600 Nomad black(sold) 2016 Salem, Antlers, 2017 Eureka Springs, Lake George, Antlers 2018 Custer NR, Antlers Login or Register to Remove Ads
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10-29-2018, 04:39 PM	#7
recumbentbob Sr. Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Newburgh IN Posts: 3,404	Wire it like the drawing shows in the link I provided. Power coming from the battery, sounds like you have too much on the tail light circuit causing the fuse to blow. __________________ VBA #01084 "A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the People to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."
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10-28-2018, 08:36 PM	#3
ldhthept Sr. Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Tallahassee FL Posts: 1,035	Can I just replace the 30A relay with a 40A to see if that cures the prob?
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10-29-2018, 09:32 AM	#6
ldhthept Sr. Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Tallahassee FL Posts: 1,035	The power to the relay is coming from the tail/brake lights, no clue how much they draw since I have added LED back there as well as running/brake lights. Will have to rewire to understand what I did because the relay has a wire with a fuse in it and I don’t know why or where it goes. Thx for replies.
	0

10-29-2018, 07:35 PM	#8
plumber63 Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: NE Indiana Posts: 985	You say you are blowing the 10 amp fuse the driving lights are on, correct? Not the running brake light fuse which sounds like you are using to trigger the relay to turn on the driving lights. If this is the case then it on the driving light side not the trigger side, so it is a issue with the driving lights or the wiring to them. __________________ Troy Donat VBA #02401 2015 Voyager 2006 1600 Nomad black(sold) 2016 Salem, Antlers, 2017 Eureka Springs, Lake George, Antlers 2018 Custer NR, Antlers
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10-29-2018, 09:07 PM	#9
ldhthept Sr. Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Tallahassee FL Posts: 1,035	Thx! Think I will just totally rewire and make sure its all correct.
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11-01-2018, 06:19 PM	#12
scooter1600 Member Join Date: Sep 2015 Location: Sale Australia Posts: 157	Also, just because they are LED bulbs doesn't mean low amperage draw. Some LED bulbs of high output can draw as much as conventional bulbs. I wired twin 55 watt LED spotlights into my buddies VN900 on the accessory circuit. No problems running the lights on the 10amp fuse for two years now.[/QUOTE] I have 2 10wt LED lights for drivers equivalent to 110wt light output on each power draw is 20wt. less than a tail /brake lamp bulb. Mark we rely on the correct information being given here __________________ 2005 Nomad 1600 Cobra tru duals Dobec EJK 2.5/3.5/1.5/6/2.5/3.5 Cadmad / K&N + original intact Progresive 412HD / Front springs also Darkside rear tire 36psi 195/55/16 Towbar/ classic trailer Penrite HPR15 diesel oil Led lights front and back
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11-02-2018, 02:14 PM	#14
Sabre-t Join Date: May 2015 Location: Marietta, GA Posts: 838	You can't always trust what cheap LED bulbs list as specs, especially on ebay. I just looked at 3 bulbs with almost the exact same description and picture as in your pic. In the details, one said 25W per bulb, another said 50W per, the 3rd said 100W per bulb (even though the product description said 50W!). The other reason I doubt the claim of 50W per bulb is that a small H3 bulb consuming 50 Watts would get ridiculously hot. Without a major heat sink or a fan, an H3 pulling 50 Watts would burn out in a few hours if not minutes.
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11-03-2018, 12:17 AM	#15
andyvh1959 Advanced Member Join Date: Dec 2017 Location: Green Bay WI Posts: 759	All very good points, especially since near every LED bulb comes from somewhere in China. They can claim whatever they want with no one questioning. I was concerned when I installed the bulbs expecting to see significant voltage top across the battery when the lights came on. Yet, even at idle, the battery voltage remained 13.5 volts, and quickly bumped up to 14.7 volts when I got the revs up to three grand. That indicates the actual wattage of the two 50 watt bulbs is likely much less that the wattage claimed. But at 50 watts per bulb, at 100 watts total, and 13.5 volts the amp draw is only 7.4 amps, well within the 10 amp fuse on the circuit. Even at 12 volts the amperage is only 8.3 amps.
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