Another darksider

[oldbikers]

Well I am officially on the darkside I bought a new Craftsman tractor and the headlights don't work WHOOPS wrong story I now have the SP 5000 195/60/16 on the bike, took it for a short ride yesterday and with the 40lbs of air pressure it seems to make the handling of the bike real easy but hell I only rode about 35 miles so what do I know http://s2.images.proboards.com/cheesy.gif http://s2.images.proboards.com/cheesy.gif

[bigdave]

Welcome to the Darkside

[Idaho]

One by one. Resistance really is futile.

Welcome. You will learn the secret handshake at the next rally.

[cactusjack]

Go put some miles on that thing, Jim! Welcome to the Darkside!

Atrum pars est validus!

[blowndodge]

Rideamist von yonder distimus...

[lonewolf]

welcome to the Darkside !!!!

[borto1990]

how much are you guys finding this tire for. a few quick searches are putting this in the $130 range.

[Yellow Jacket]

I just bought one for $79 plus shipping from tires-easy a few weeks ago.

Dunlop SP 5000 195/60r-16

http://www.tireseasy.com/

[Kawhead]

And another one see's the light of the Darkside. Once your in they ain't no gettin' out.

[metalman]

The more you ride it, the better you'll like it.

[MAS Tequila]

You are going to crash and burn.

hehehehe

I heard that a couple times today. The funny thing is that they couldn't keep up in the twisties.

MT

[dank]

The funny thing is that they couldn't keep up in the twisties.

MT

I’m glad you are enjoying your tire. But are you sure the car tire was the difference? What were they riding? Nomads? ZX-14’s? Triumph Thunderbirds? C109RT’s? It makes a difference.

I find all this excitement over car tires humorous. I agree they are a fine tire on a Nomad and that the Nomad is a great cruiser. However, let’s be honest. You can talk all you want to about how car and truck tires corner just as well as motorcycle tires, but then look at the ST1300, FRJ, C-14 or sport bike sites and see if anyone is using a car tire. Those bikes wear out rear tires much faster than Nomads, and the owners would like longer tire life, but nobody runs a car tire.

The only reason Nomads get away with it is because the Nomad’s set-up and suspension corners smoothly, but relatively slowly to begin with. Nomads are fun to ride, but basically have very little lean angle, and they corner about like a standard sedan. Thus a car tire fits the bill. So while it is true that car tires last longer and seem to have little impact on a Nomad’s performance in corners, the case is being way overstated by extrapolating that car and truck tires are great on motorcycles and make a Nomad into some type of demon in the twisties. Doubt me? Come and see if your truck or car tire can beat my motorcycle tires through a series of corners. Good luck!! I’ll bring some donuts to eat while I wait for you at the end, and I’m not an aggressive rider.

What you are really saying is: A Nomad has somewhat limited performance in corners, so you really don’t need a motorcycle tire to get the best out of it. A car or truck tire works just fine. I’m not knocking putting one on a Nomad. It seems to be a good match. That combination is what I’d likely be riding if they had come out with a 1600 Nomad, or maybe even the 1700 Nomad , with ABS. But let’s not generalize so much about car tires being better than motorcycles tires or suggest it makes a Nomad into some kind of asphalt ripping monster.

[taranis]

I ride with a group of guys where one rides an '07 Goldwing with a car tire on the back, and he easily keeps up with another one of our group on a BMW K1200GT - a bike comparable to your ST1300.

I'm not going to say which is better than the other. I'm considering a CT but haven't done it yet, simply because the Cobra is lasting a lot longer than I expected (12,000 miles so far). Frankly, I don't think a Nomad could keep up with a ST at all, no matter what rubber's installed. They're two completely different machines, in every regard.

The Goldwing, however, is in a class of it's own. They guy with the '07 I ride with rides it like a sport bike and when he does a "Wing Fling", down a twisty road - he is g-o-n-e. I've also asked him how he like the cornering performance vs a m/c tire, and he said over and over again, the difference is negligible. It's different, but doesn't hinder his cornering ability at all. Seeing him ride, I have no doubt.

Given the truth of that statement, and the limitations of a Nomad's performance when compared to a Goldwing, the car tire makes perfect sense. I don't think it improves performance in the curves, but I certainly don't see where it's a hindrance either.

I doubt the validity that CT's are only for "slow" bikes too. The Goldwing is made to be ridden aggressively if the rider chooses, and the CT he uses works just as well, if not better, than the m/c tire he replaced.

[blowndodge]

The funny thing is that they couldn't keep up in the twisties.

MT

I’m glad you are enjoying your tire. But are you sure the car tire was the difference? What were they riding? Nomads? ZX-14’s? Triumph Thunderbirds? C109RT’s? It makes a difference.

I find all this excitement over car tires humorous. I agree they are a fine tire on a Nomad and that the Nomad is a great cruiser. However, let’s be honest. You can talk all you want to about how car and truck tires corner just as well as motorcycle tires, but then look at the ST1300, FRJ, C-14 or sport bike sites and see if anyone is using a car tire. Those bikes wear out rear tires much faster than Nomads, and the owners would like longer tire life, but nobody runs a car tire.

The only reason Nomads get away with it is because the Nomad’s set-up and suspension corners smoothly, but relatively slowly to begin with. Nomads are fun to ride, but basically have very little lean angle, and they corner about like a standard sedan. Thus a car tire fits the bill. So while it is true that car tires last longer and seem to have little impact on a Nomad’s performance in corners, the case is being way overstated by extrapolating that car and truck tires are great on motorcycles and make a Nomad into some type of demon in the twisties. Doubt me? Come and see if your truck or car tire can beat my motorcycle tires through a series of corners. Good luck!! I’ll bring some donuts to eat while I wait for you at the end, and I’m not an aggressive rider.

What you are really saying is: A Nomad has somewhat limited performance in corners, so you really don’t need a motorcycle tire to get the best out of it. A car or truck tire works just fine. I’m not knocking putting one on a Nomad. It seems to be a good match. That combination is what I’d likely be riding if they had come out with a 1600 Nomad, or maybe even the 1700 Nomad , with ABS. But let’s not generalize so much about car tires being better than motorcycles tires or suggest it makes a Nomad into some kind of asphalt ripping monster.


I could have sworn up and down this was a Nomad site!! Really I could! who give a rats butt if a car tire isn't the best choice for a ST1300 or FJR or CBR1000?

I find it humorous that Manufactures put racing tires on the monster boys ultra high performance bikes that are bald in 3K miles because all these squids do is burn rubber and ride like Kenny Roberts wannabes. Not putting down these bikes but I've never seen a superbike that didn't have a blad flat spot right down the middle of the tire with almost no wear on the sides! Now THAT is humorous

To each his own...

[glwilson]

Think I am going to get a beer, then sit and wait to see how this whole thing turns out. http://s2.images.proboards.com/shocked.gif

It is getting interesting. ;)

[Kawhead]

Here we go.................I wonder if back when all there was to have were square profile tires for motorbikes; I wonder if the folks that tried the round tires and liked them had to hear this chit ??? I wonder if they called going to the round tyres the Lightside ??? Or the Enlightenside ??? ::)

[Cajunrider]

Maybe "The Humorous Side".

[dank]

And..you all keep forgetting the real glory of a car tire on a Nomad: With the flat tread, car tires don't show chicken strips! http://s2.images.proboards.com/grin.gif

[lonewolf]

thought about this for a day, not wanting to blow up about it ! and decided that uniformed opinions mean nothing to me ! I know what i have, and know what it will do ! nuff said!!!!

[dank]

thought about this for a day, not wanting to blow up about it ! and decided that uniformed opinions mean nothing to me ! I know what i have, and know what it will do ! nuff said!!!!

Good. I always admire a man who is content in the condition in which he finds himself.

Clearly what I said hit a nerve in some people, or maybe some ironed their shorts with too much starch this morning, but come on, at least read what I said. I didn’t say anything against a car tire on a Nomad. In fact I said it is a good match and that I’d likely have one too if Kawasaki had simply made an ABS Nomad. I wanted an ABS bike due to the amount of rainy weather in which I ride. I loved my Nomad. Nomads are cool. Not fast, but cool, reliable, and comfortable on a long ride. But don’t suggest that a car tire on a Nomad makes them out corner other bikes that previously could beat it through the twisties.

All I pointed out is the truth that car tires don’t make Nomads into great bikes in the twisties, (still fun: yes; fast: no), as seems to be becoming prevalent in the darksider comments, and that darksiders are overstating when they imply that car tires are better than motorcycle tires in anything other than tire life. Longer life, yes. Given. Able to stop: Sure. Able to corner in accord with traffic flow: You bet. Nimble in the twisties: LOL. Car tires only seem comparable in that for a limited sector of bikes that aren’t very nimble to begin with. The fact that they are capable of cornering and stopping doesn’t make them better when the chips are down and every possible degree of maneuverability is needed, even on a Nomad. That is why everyone talks about needing to get used to them and the car tires requiring more countersteering input. That is just another way of saying that they are not as nimble as a bike tire on the same bike. Doesn’t mean they don’t work or are dangerous. Perhaps less safe in some situations where swerving is required. They may also be slightly better in a straight-line stop: seems intuitive that they would be due to the fat footprint, but then again, 75% of the braking comes from the front tire, so the real impact is probably marginal and would need actual data to reveal it.

[cactusjack]

thought about this for a day, not wanting to blow up about it ! and decided that uniformed opinions mean nothing to me ! I know what i have, and know what it will do ! nuff said!!!!

Good. I always admire a man who is content in the condition in which he finds himself.

Clearly what I said hit a nerve in some people, or maybe some ironed their shorts with too much starch this morning, but come on, at least read what I said. I didn’t say anything against a car tire on a Nomad. In fact I said it is a good match and that I’d likely have one too if Kawasaki had simply made an ABS Nomad. I wanted an ABS bike due to the amount of rainy weather in which I ride. I loved my Nomad. Nomads are cool. Not fast, but cool, reliable, and comfortable on a long ride. But don’t suggest that a car tire on a Nomad makes them out corner other bikes that previously could beat it through the twisties.

All I pointed out is the truth that car tires don’t make Nomads into great bikes in the twisties, (still fun: yes; fast: no), as seems to be becoming prevalent in the darksider comments, and that darksiders are overstating when they imply that car tires are better than motorcycle tires in anything other than tire life. Longer life, yes. Given. Able to stop: Sure. Able to corner in accord with traffic flow: You bet. Nimble in the twisties: LOL. Car tires are only seem comparable in that for a limited sector of bikes that aren’t very nimble to begin with. The fact that they are capable of cornering and stopping doesn’t make them better when the chips are down and every possible degree of maneuverability is needed, even on a Nomad. That is why everyone talks about needing to get used to them and the car tires requiring more countersteering input. That is just another way of saying that they are not as nimble as a bike tire on the same bike. Doesn’t mean they don’t work or are dangerous. Perhaps less safe in some situations where swerving is required. They may also be slightly better in a straight-line stop: seems intuitive that they would be due to the fat footprint, but then again, 75% of the braking comes from the front tire, so the real impact is probably marginal and would need actual data to reveal it.



I am going to agree with you here. While a car tire may not be appropriate for all bikes, it works on a Nomad and it works well. I wouldn't want a car tire on a Hayabusa, a Ninja, or a GSXR, for example. My Nomad doesn't corner like a sports bike and I don't ride it like one.

[dantama]

thought about this for a day, not wanting to blow up about it ! and decided that uniformed opinions mean nothing to me ! I know what i have, and know what it will do ! nuff said!!!!

Good. I always admire a man who is content in the condition in which he finds himself.

Clearly what I said hit a nerve in some people, or maybe some ironed their shorts with too much starch this morning, but come on, at least read what I said. I didn’t say anything against a car tire on a Nomad. In fact I said it is a good match and that I’d likely have one too if Kawasaki had simply made an ABS Nomad. I wanted an ABS bike due to the amount of rainy weather in which I ride. I loved my Nomad. Nomads are cool. Not fast, but cool, reliable, and comfortable on a long ride. But don’t suggest that a car tire on a Nomad makes them out corner other bikes that previously could beat it through the twisties.

All I pointed out is the truth that car tires don’t make Nomads into great bikes in the twisties, (still fun: yes; fast: no), as seems to be becoming prevalent in the darksider comments, and that darksiders are overstating when they imply that car tires are better than motorcycle tires in anything other than tire life. Longer life, yes. Given. Able to stop: Sure. Able to corner in accord with traffic flow: You bet. Nimble in the twisties: LOL. Car tires only seem comparable in that for a limited sector of bikes that aren’t very nimble to begin with. The fact that they are capable of cornering and stopping doesn’t make them better when the chips are down and every possible degree of maneuverability is needed, even on a Nomad. That is why everyone talks about needing to get used to them and the car tires requiring more countersteering input. That is just another way of saying that they are not as nimble as a bike tire on the same bike. Doesn’t mean they don’t work or are dangerous. Perhaps less safe in some situations where swerving is required. They may also be slightly better in a straight-line stop: seems intuitive that they would be due to the fat footprint, but then again, 75% of the braking comes from the front tire, so the real impact is probably marginal and would need actual data to reveal it.



I agree with you dank, but I haven't drank the cool aide yet :)

I've only gone as far as ordering the tire, and ordering the magic beads. I'd like to test my tire before getting the new one on, but I want a warm day were the pavement and tires are warm. Hasn't happened yet, though yesterday was close. I'd like to test them both at the same temperature.

As you stated, once the weight shift gets the weight onto the front tire, the rear isn't doing much in a full-on stop. In a regular stop, where not as much weight transfers the extra traction out back my pay dividends.

As you said, other than longer tire life there might not be any improvement unless you were near the limits of adhesion. It's hard to do any seat-of-the-pants testing at the limit, but it would be interesting to know what one comes out on top just barely inside the envelope.

Mind you, that is the rational side of me talking. Once I get the tire on, and learn the secret hand shakes I'll be talking about how nothing could be better! :)

[blowndodge]

Hey there is no starch in my shirts or shorts!! http://s2.images.proboards.com/grin.gif

I can only imagine the feedback I would received if Nomad owners on this site had to hear my comment on how humorous adding a TFI is. Or how humorous adding a fairing is....

I find it humorous that the " Darkside Unexperience" believe they have a "viable" opinion http://s2.images.proboards.com/grin.gif

Hopefully ya'alls get my point! http://s2.images.proboards.com/grin.gif Now where did I put that iron???!!!

[skeeter]

Rideamist von yonder distimus...
http://s2.images.proboards.com/grin.gif

[glwilson]

Is that it??

Nothing more on this??

I haven't even finished my first beer yet... I brought a whole cooler full hoping to be able to sit awhile and watch...

...guess not. http://s2.images.proboards.com/grin.gif

[Cajunrider]

Is that it??

Nothing more on this??

I haven't even finished my first beer yet... I brought a whole cooler full hoping to be able to sit awhile and watch...

...guess not. http://s2.images.proboards.com/grin.gif

Instigator http://s2.images.proboards.com/grin.gif

[blowndodge]

You want more Greg?!!! Pass one of dem beers dis way!!!

I've already called Dan a Pansie for his indecisiveness. A guy that off roads his nomad and runs it up and down cement river walls is balking on a Car Tire? What more do you want! He watches the 'Factor' so he can't all be bad? (drink the coolaid) http://s2.images.proboards.com/grin.gif

dan is really dank without the "k"

[taranis]

Nimble in the twisties: LOL. Car tires only seem comparable in that for a limited sector of bikes that aren’t very nimble to begin with.

Still disagree. I took the picture below last year. It is of the Gold Wing rider I mentioned on my previous post, on the Pig Trail in Arkansas (Hwy 7). The shot below was taken on a 35mph curve and he went though doing around 65-70. Note the car tire on the back.

http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l139/taranis17/Arkansas%20Rides/Capture.jpg

You can say Gold Wings aren't nimble if you want, but I know at least two riders who would disagree with you.

The rest of your post, for the most part, I agree with. But with all due respect, I think you're wrong here. Not only could he ride a LOT faster than me through curves like this (and there were MANY), but he had absolutely no problem with stability or traction during the entire 4 day trip of some hard, technical riding. A little further down the road from where I took this, I had a chance to ride his bike. From my own limited experience, the ride doesn't feel much different than a m/c tire, but I do notice it in the curves. It's not something that's immediately cause for more aggressive counter-steering - it's much more subtle than that and if you're concentrating on anything else, you'll miss it. I can full well understand those riders who have gotten used to that feel and now don't even notice it. It's like wearing a wristwatch: You know it's there and you can feel it if you want, but most of the time, you don't notice it.

I'm just sayin'.....

[Yellow Jacket]

I guess I've missed the posts where the statements have been made claiming that the CT turns the Nomad (or other heavy cruisers) into crotch rockets in the twisities. :)

I know I've never made any such claim. I will say that I don't think the steering effort has increased any, at least for me. Others may have experienced that but I can't speak for them.

Now, for the twisties. On my bike the CT performs just as good as the MT. I have scraped the floorboards while riding the Tail of the Dragon with both tires and could not tell any difference in cornering speed or tracking. (Maybe this is due to my short 4 years of experience riding a heavy cruiser) It seems to me that the limiting factor with either tire is the maximum lean angle of the Nomad. To go any faster you would need to remove parts that drag so that you could lean further. I have no intention of doing so since my philosophy of riding is enjoyment, not how fast I can burn through the corners.

I think it would be an interesting excercise for someone to put a CT on a sport bike and see if it performs better or worse than a MT. I won't be the one to do it because I don't have a sport bike and don't want one.

Don't forget that a lot of the comments here are sometimes sort of tongue-in-cheek. http://s2.images.proboards.com/grin.gif

[dank]

dan is really dank without the "k"

Whoa now, that's going to far. No reason to insult Dan like that. But I don't see why anyone expected a big dust up from my stating a bunch of facts. http://s2.images.proboards.com/cool.gif True is true. What else can be said? http://s2.images.proboards.com/grin.gif

[taranis]

Now that's instigation! LOL http://s2.images.proboards.com/cheesy.gif

[blowndodge]

dan is really dank without the "k"

Whoa now, that's going to far. No reason to insult Dan like that. But I don't see why anyone expected a big dust up from my stating a bunch of facts. http://s2.images.proboards.com/cool.gif True is true. What else can be said? http://s2.images.proboards.com/grin.gif

That's is so correct!! and when a NON car tire Nomad rider speaks it we will all listen!!! http://s2.images.proboards.com/grin.gif

[dantama]

my philosophy of riding is enjoyment, not how fast I can burn through the corners.




I'll tell you what you are Bob, you are a boring old man, that is what you are!! ;) http://s2.images.proboards.com/tongue.gif http://s2.images.proboards.com/grin.gif

[blowndodge]

I love boring!!!! that's why I come here!! http://s2.images.proboards.com/grin.gif

[Yellow Jacket]

[quote="Yellow Jacket":wdozgqlw]

my philosophy of riding is enjoyment, not how fast I can burn through the corners.




I'll tell you what you are Bob, you are a boring old man, that is what you are!! ;) http://s2.images.proboards.com/tongue.gif http://s2.images.proboards.com/grin.gif[/quote:wdozgqlw]

You're absolutely correct!

I did all that "un-boring wild street racing and seeing how fast I could go and then try to top that" stuff when I was young and indestructible, as well as immortal. http://s2.images.proboards.com/grin.gif

Now I'm no longer young, realize that I'm not indestructible and know for a certainty that I'm not immortal.

If you young bucks live long enough you will also come to those conclusions. http://s2.images.proboards.com/grin.gif

So actually, the tag of "old boring man" should be worn proudly! !

I still remember when Junior Johnson was, I think, in his sixties and was no longer a NASCAR driver but was an owner. He hired young bucks to drive his cars for him. This one day during practice his young buck hired driver couldn't get the car to get over a 190 mph lap speed. Junior thought the driver was doing something wrong so he decided to make a few laps himself and prove there was nothing wrong with the car. He made about 5 laps at around 160 mph lap speeds and brought it back to the pit. The crew chief asked Junior, "What the heck is wrong with the car?" Junior replied, "Ain't nothing wrong with that car, I just couldn't make myself make it go any faster! ! Damn it all to Hell! !"

http://s2.images.proboards.com/grin.gif http://s2.images.proboards.com/grin.gif http://s2.images.proboards.com/grin.gif ROFL http://s2.images.proboards.com/grin.gif http://s2.images.proboards.com/grin.gif http://s2.images.proboards.com/grin.gif

Dang, I sure do love this place! ! http://s2.images.proboards.com/grin.gif

[Cajunrider]

Guess I'm wearing the same "old" tag Bob. No more interest in speed here either.

[chainsaw]

Who's Junior Johnson? :) Just kidding,

[oldbikers]

Hell I just got my car tire because the MT wouldn't hold air with a big hole in it.

[dank]

I'm with all of you: Old, all the carefree and zaniness worn out of me. Enjoy just putting around gawking at scenery and stopping for pie and coffee......................................

But my bike's a lot younger than I am, so I have to compromise and let loose bit now and then just in fairness to it! Can't expect it to always corner like an old man. Wouldn't be fair.

[dantama]

Like Bingo night at the freakin Retirement Center around here! :)

[blowndodge]

Who are all brave/mature enough to understand the advantages of running a car tire babysitting the younger crowd and comforting them on the frightening thought of running a car tire themself!!

Maturity does have it's advantages!! http://s2.images.proboards.com/grin.gif

[Yellow Jacket]

Like Bingo night at the freakin Retirement Center around here! :)

Ok. You do realize that old guys still know how to have fun? We just don't usually make a big deal out of it. http://s2.images.proboards.com/grin.gif

Does this look boring? Nuff said. http://s2.images.proboards.com/grin.gif

http://i241.photobucket.com/albums/ff109/retsiem/Fun%20stuff/Yellowsuitsportbike.jpg

[dantama]

[quote="Dan Lund":3v71keac]Like Bingo night at the freakin Retirement Center around here! :)

Ok. You do realize that old guys still know how to have fun? We just don't usually make a big deal out of it. http://s2.images.proboards.com/grin.gif

Does this look boring? Nuff said. http://s2.images.proboards.com/grin.gif

[/quote:3v71keac]


Compared to a room full of rich beautiful woman, hanging out naked, looking for a guy to lavish love and money on... Ya, kind of boring.

It's all relative Bob http://s2.images.proboards.com/cheesy.gif

[Yellow Jacket]

ROFLMAO! ! http://s2.images.proboards.com/grin.gif http://s2.images.proboards.com/grin.gif http://s2.images.proboards.com/grin.gif http://s2.images.proboards.com/grin.gif

[blowndodge]

I don't want to here what your doing with relatives Dan!! http://s2.images.proboards.com/grin.gif